I'm excited for Oklahoma's first 4-stack interchange, it's Long Overdue. Too bad they didn't design a flyover from W-Bound I-44 to S-Bound I-235 Downtown instead of keeping that old cloverleaf; we'd have a 5-stack.

Perhaps there a chance the rebuild of the I-40/I-44 interchange could be done.

I think this will eventually happen. That interchange is horrible also, but they should of did it when they realigned I-40 years ago.

keep in mind the old cloverleaf's are going away these will be bigger cloverleafs that don't merge with the mainline southbound 235

If you look at this construction phasing plan document (http://www.okladot.state.ok.us/contracts/a2018/plans1811/530_1811_NHPPI-2350-(009)PM_0903327/299-0903327-SUGGESTED%20SEQUENCE%20OF%20CONSTRUCTION%20(4).pdf ), it doesn't appear that the cloverleafs will get any bigger - but they will be optimizing where the entrance and exit to each one is, to mostly eliminate interference points where traffic has to merge in front of each other. For instance, the southbound I-235 to eastbound I-44 cloverleaf will have it's own protected lane as it merges with I-44 E. The only remaining interference point will be on the southbound I-235 on/off ramp bridge; it won't be in any of the mainline lanes of southbound I-235. This should all help traffic flow much, much more smoothly.

Here is a general plan centered over the interchange if anyone is interested. They have been working on the northwest quadrant piers for the past few weeks while doing grading work everywhere else. Pier 13 will be constructed directly to the east of the current northbound lanes and will eventually sit between northbound and southbound. They already dug out a pad for the boring machine to work on.

http://www.okladot.state.ok.us/contracts/a2018/plans1811/530_1811_NHPPI-2350-(009)PM_0903327/K-01-0903327-GENERAL%20PLAN%20&%20ELEVATION%20(1).pdf

Here is a general plan centered over the interchange if anyone is interested. They have been working on the northwest quadrant piers for the past few weeks while doing grading work everywhere else. Pier 13 will be constructed directly to the east of the current northbound lanes and will eventually sit between northbound and southbound. They already dug out a pad for the boring machine to work on.

http://www.okladot.state.ok.us/contracts/a2018/plans1811/530_1811_NHPPI-2350-(009)PM_0903327/K-01-0903327-GENERAL%20PLAN%20&%20ELEVATION%20(1).pdf

So if correct this means they will build a new n/s overpass first (northbound) and then can shift northbound to the new lanes. And then keep southbound in existing lanes while tearing down/rebuilding the old northbound section and when done that will be the new southbound lanes. And then tear down current southbound lanes last.

So when done everything is shifted to the east (the n/s 235 overpasses).

Way too early question:

Wonder if they will install those deicing/preicing liquid systems on all the flyover ramps? Its a pipe running along walls which releases anti freezing agents.

So if correct this means they will build a new n/s overpass first (northbound) and then can shift northbound to the new lanes. And then keep southbound in existing lanes while tearing down/rebuilding the old northbound section and when done that will be the new southbound lanes. And then tear down current southbound lanes last.

So when done everything is shifted to the east (the n/s 235 overpasses).

Yes, flyover ramps are probably priority as eastern leafs are in the way of shifting everything east.

I'm guessing the answer to the deicing system would be no.

Here is a general plan centered over the interchange if anyone is interested. They have been working on the northwest quadrant piers for the past few weeks while doing grading work everywhere else. Pier 13 will be constructed directly to the east of the current northbound lanes and will eventually sit between northbound and southbound. They already dug out a pad for the boring machine to work on.

http://www.okladot.state.ok.us/contracts/a2018/plans1811/530_1811_NHPPI-2350-(009)PM_0903327/K-01-0903327-GENERAL%20PLAN%20&%20ELEVATION%20(1).pdf

I still wince every time I look at this plan. Even though there are southbound c/d lanes, there will still be stop and go traffic on it due to the weaving created by the 2 remaining cloverleafs.

I suppose they could add in the remaining flyovers at some point.

I'm not too concerned about the I-235N-to-I-44W as much as I am about I-44W-to-I-235S Downtown, that one during the morning rush hour or major event(s) should already be hell and likely will continue to be with that clover remaining. At least this one should be developed to a flyover IMO.

I suppose they could add in the remaining flyovers at some point.

I'm not too concerned about the I-235N-to-I-44W as much as I am about I-44W-to-I-235S Downtown, that one during the morning rush hour or major event(s) should already be hell and likely will continue to be with that clover remaining. At least this one should be developed to a flyover IMO.

At best they could add a westbound I-44 ramp to southbound I-235 ramp with the amount of space there is to work with. This may need to be part of a Lincoln/I-44 interchange project because the ramp would need to start around here. You can tell with the dirt work happening now that the southbound ramp to westbound is going to be pretty tall.

I-240 interchange project has a better design with placement of flyovers but I guess that wasn't possible with I-44.

Although its still early I’m glad they have kept 50mph through the work zone. Last phase it was 35. It might still drop to 35 as they progress but so far no complaints. They are working hard from what I see. Early finish incentives were the best thing ever for road projects

Be aware


Oklahoma Department of Transportation
@OKDOT
OKC: Major ramp closures on I-44 to I-235 from 7 p.m. tonight to 6 a.m. Thursday for on-going construction. Details here (link: http://ow.ly/7LhY50udIC5) ow.ly/7LhY50udIC5
5:35 PM · May 15, 2019 · Hootsuite Inc.

This is a pretty good overview.

Dotted lines show the future alignments.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/i235i44051819a.jpg

So a question. Since they are expanding to 3 lanes and just south of Hefner driving on 235S the lanes got from 3 to 2 (far left lane merges). I would imagine once done they make that 3? It was built for 3 so all they have to do is re-stripe so is that the plan? Its over 2 miles north of 44 but would make sense.

It looks like OpenStreetMap is a little out of date, the northbound exit to 50th was completed a few months ago,

I hope they will just brand the Broadway Extension as I-235 rather than "ending" it at I-44. Most people probably already refer to it as 235 (as in post above) and I'm sure the BE is built beyond Interstate Standards. ...

From this morning:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/i235i44051919a.jpg

I hope they will just brand the Broadway Extension as I-235 rather than "ending" it at I-44. Most people probably already refer to it as 235 (as in post above) and I'm sure the BE is built beyond Interstate Standards. ...I highly doubt they do that. I wish Broadway through Edmond would be converted to a fully controlled access facility at least to 15th or at the bare minimum turned into an expressway. No way that happens though if it did a route extension of I-235 should at least to Kilpatrick.

Gah, Broadway converted to an expressway up to 15th sounds god-awful. It's so pedestrian unfriendly as is, that would be an terrible change.

I’ve heard a few other folks refer to the intersection of the Kilpatrick and the Broadway Extension as Kilpatrick and I-235, which is incorrect as 235 ends almost 5 miles to the south at I-44. It really doesn’t hurt anything if they think that way, but when someone is receiving directions in that fashion, it can sure screw them up.

I don’t think the feds are expanding the interstate system right now. Once it has a federal designator (I-235) there’s more burden on the Feds for upkeep. I believe somewhere in Arizona has been trying for years to get a I- designator on a highway they built to federal interstate standards and has not been able to convince the feds.

Gah, Broadway converted to an expressway up to 15th sounds god-awful. It's so pedestrian unfriendly as is, that would be an terrible change.
Yeah because everything everywhere has to be pedestrian friendly. Grade separation saves lives. Edmond needs traffic relief. Not embarking on a goose chase to make six lane thoroughfares pedestrian friendly, IMO. There are plenty of other parts of the city where pedestrian oriented projects should go. Broadway south of 15th is NOT one of them.

I don’t think the feds are expanding the interstate system right now. Once it has a federal designator (I-235) there’s more burden on the Feds for upkeep. I believe somewhere in Arizona has been trying for years to get a I- designator on a highway they built to federal interstate standards and has not been able to convince the feds.

There are plenty of new routings like I-11, I-14, I-69, I-49, etc. that are being built along with various 3DIs being designated in cities. NC is on a hot streak with new interstates.

Yeah because everything everywhere has to be pedestrian friendly. Grade separation saves lives. Edmond needs traffic relief. Not embarking on a goose chase to make six lane thoroughfares pedestrian friendly, IMO. There are plenty of other parts of the city where pedestrian oriented projects should go. Broadway south of 15th is NOT one of them.

Probably not anymore of a goose chase than making it a controlled access up to 33rd or 15th for that matter. The controlled access highway ship set sail a long time ago. Imagine the expenses from ROW alone and all the businesses that have to close or shutdown. You would have better luck turning highway 9 into controlled access and that is pretty slim.

I hope they will just brand the Broadway Extension as I-235 rather than "ending" it at I-44. Most people probably already refer to it as 235 (as in post above) and I'm sure the BE is built beyond Interstate Standards. ...

To do that would violate AASHTO route numbering rules. A 3 digit interstate beginning with an even number has to begin and end at another interstate. However, there are exceptions made. I635's western end in Dallas is one that comes to mind. The western extension from I35 was an afterthought.

Probably not anymore of a goose chase than making it a controlled access up to 33rd or 15th for that matter. The controlled access highway ship set sail a long time ago. Imagine the expenses from ROW alone and all the businesses that have to close or shutdown. You would have better luck turning highway 9 into controlled access and that is pretty slim.
There would have to be little to no business closures. TxDOT is able to put 8 lane freeways in ROW the size of the Broadway. A depressed freeway would do wonders. I would disagree that my plan would be more of a goose chase than one trying to make this road pedestrian friendly.

At the very most, there might be a handful of businesses that would be impacted and most of it would be parking lots. With a depressed freeway with service lanes and tight diamond interchanges, it would work very well. But Oklahoma is cheap and this project would cost north of a billion dollars. I agree no way it happens but because Oklahoma. That is my opinion.

At the very least, tolled over or under passes would be nice and could likely fit in the median.

To do that would violate AASHTO route numbering rules. A 3 digit interstate beginning with an even number has to begin and end at another interstate. However, there are exceptions made. I635's western end in Dallas is one that comes to mind. The western extension from I35 was an afterthought.


I-44 routed down the Kilpatrick Tollway to SH-74. Solved. ;)

Wasn't there a plan from ODOT decades back where they wanted to turn 23rd through Midtown into an access controlled highway cutting through the city, but the city rightfully pushed back and prevented it? This access controlled broadway extension up to 15th idea feels like exactly that, turning a city street into a highway for no particularly good reason other than someone wanting to be able to drive fast on it.

Wasn't there a plan from ODOT decades back where they wanted to turn 23rd through Midtown into an access controlled highway cutting through the city, but the city rightfully pushed back and prevented it? This access controlled broadway extension up to 15th idea feels like exactly that, turning a city street into a highway for no particularly good reason other than someone wanting to be able to drive fast on it.

I recall seeing a document when I was a kid showing NE 23rd east of I-35 being upgraded to a limited access highway connecting to the east outer loop they had designed at that time down Sooner Rd. I don't recall seeing 23rd being upgraded anywhere through the mid city.

I recall seeing a document when I was a kid showing NE 23rd east of I-35 being upgraded to a limited access highway connecting to the east outer loop they had designed at that time down Sooner Rd. I don't recall seeing 23rd being upgraded anywhere through the mid city.

there was a plan for a inner NE loop connecting to the 44 I35 63rd area and I40 and 240 but the NE side was so against it that is was killed ... (this was a major mistake )

Are you thinking of what they called the Sooner Expressway at the time that was to start at the Turner Turnpike gate and then run down Sooner Rd? The higher speed access to Sooner Rd at that interchange was the start of that project but was abandoned later. I agree, it was a mistake to stop it. I don't recall the exact route but it was to pretty much go down Sooner Rd to Norman and I-35 south of the S. Canadian River. IMO, the current east county toll Rd. is ridiculously far east to be useful to very many.

I-44 routed down the Kilpatrick Tollway to SH-74. Solved. ;)

or better yet, why not sign the Kilpatrick Turnpike as I-844 and all of Broadway up to and just beyond it at I-235 since it's claimed that way anyway.

I'd also feel good if Hefner Parkway was signed I-144 spur.

or better yet, why not sign the Kilpatrick Turnpike as I-844 and all of Broadway up to and just beyond it at I-235 since it's claimed that way anyway.

I'd also feel good if Hefner Parkway was signed I-144 spur.

Would the bouncy bridges on the west part of the Kilpatrick qualify for interstate standards? :)

Wasn't there a plan from ODOT decades back where they wanted to turn 23rd through Midtown into an access controlled highway cutting through the city, but the city rightfully pushed back and prevented it? This access controlled broadway extension up to 15th idea feels like exactly that, turning a city street into a highway for no particularly good reason other than someone wanting to be able to drive fast on it.
I’m not seeing how a six lane divided road with a 50 foot median compares to 23rd in midtown

An apples to apples comparison would be more akin to HWY 9 in Norman or NWE. This isn’t about people wanting to drive faster though they would be able to under my plan, it’s abojt moving traffic better.

Are you thinking of what they called the Sooner Expressway at the time that was to start at the Turner Turnpike gate and then run down Sooner Rd? The higher speed access to Sooner Rd at that interchange was the start of that project but was abandoned later. I agree, it was a mistake to stop it. I don't recall the exact route but it was to pretty much go down Sooner Rd to Norman and I-35 south of the S. Canadian River. IMO, the current east county toll Rd. is ridiculously far east to be useful to very many.
But but but wouldn’t it have been better to build for pedestrians and not cars!? LOL. I concur.

Would the bouncy bridges on the west part of the Kilpatrick qualify for interstate standards? :)

Those are being fixed by taking the old deck and beams off then replacing them correctly. They are expanding it to 6 lanes at the same time.

Project is ramping up. I-44 is now being slightly shifted in order to work on bridge piers for new I235 bridges and overpasses in median.

Project is ramping up. I-44 is now being slightly shifted in order to work on bridge piers for new I235 bridges and overpasses in median.

Amazing with all this rain it hasn’t completely shut them down. Hoping they can get it done early for a bonus payoff. Best thing ever invented is early completion incentives. The only thing that slows down construction these days is weather or funding.

Does anyone have any idea of how long the on-ramp to I-44 from Grand is expected to be closed?

Does anyone have any idea of how long the on-ramp to I-44 from Grand is expected to be closed?

According to this, mid-June.

https://www.ok.gov/triton/modules/newsroom/newsroom_article.php?id=277&article_id=51461

I wouldn't doubt if it is much later due to the weather. It looks like they are paving the Deep Fork Creek channel below these bridges. Hard to do that with all the water we've had.

The merge point from Broadway Extension northbound to I-44 westbound is going to be a hassle for a while. If you drive a low-to-the-ground vehicle, it's generally hard to see beyond the high grass right there anyway. Now, they've got workers' cars parked in that little island, as well as the highway patrol cars on the access road to slow people down. All that makes for a near-stop instead of a merge coming off the cloverleaf. Just a heads-up.

Overpass can't come fast enough! Probably looking at another year before that part of the project is completed.

The merge point from Broadway Extension northbound to I-44 westbound is going to be a hassle for a while. If you drive a low-to-the-ground vehicle, it's generally hard to see beyond the high grass right there anyway. Now, they've got workers' cars parked in that little island, as well as the highway patrol cars on the access road to slow people down. All that makes for a near-stop instead of a merge coming off the cloverleaf. Just a heads-up.

Plus they added more Jersey barriers that make it even harder to see when merging onto the westbound c/d lane.

SB was bad this morning. Looks like they are going to shift those lanes over to the NB side past 63rd and then shift them back right before the bridge. It was bad because they are in the process of demolishing the concrete divider.

Interesting sequencing of construction. They will probably have both sides of the road done before they get even one of the bridges done. The rebar for the overpasses started going up too.

How long is I44 expected to remain 2 lanes? Seems like it's gonna be that way for a while.

How long is I44 expected to remain 2 lanes? Seems like it's gonna be that way for a while.

End of project or close to it. The south bound bridge is going to be the last thing to be completed and they can't build those bridge piers until existing south bound is demolished.

So there is going to be work happening in the middle for awhile.

SB was bad this morning. Looks like they are going to shift those lanes over to the NB side past 63rd and then shift them back right before the bridge. It was bad because they are in the process of demolishing the concrete divider.

Interesting sequencing of construction. They will probably have both sides of the road done before they get even one of the bridges done. The rebar for the overpasses started going up too.

Summer/mornings are usually best traffic conditions of the year with school out and workers on vacations. Imagine its gonna get bad in late Aug once school is back in. I check traffic apps every morning and it paid off today as I saw 235 S backed up or very slow all the way to Hefner. Took an alt route and it was fine just have to deal with lights and slowkeypokes.

And wow the cops were out for $$$ this morning. Bike cops, car cops and SUV cops they were all building coffers this morning! Luckily I always scan my mirrors I got on 235 south of construction. Between 36th and 23rd I could see a bike cop about half a mile back coming same way. Was in middle lane and pacing around 64-65 but some poor sap was in passing lane going at least 70 and got nailed. Had I not been observant that mighta been me forking out “extra tax” to OKC lol.

the cops were out here in the Seattle area also. ...

EVERY single afternoon for the past week or so, 235-Northbound traffic is bottlenecked over the bridge. It is really causing traffic to back up on 235. I am there pretty early - around 4pm everyday. Unfortunately, I really do not have alternative besides taking side streets.

EVERY single afternoon for the past week or so, 235-Northbound traffic is bottlenecked over the bridge. It is really causing traffic to back up on 235. I am there pretty early - around 4pm everyday. Unfortunately, I really do not have alternative besides taking side streets.

When did you start this commute? It has been like this @ rush hours for at least a decade.

….about 15 years ago. It hasn't been this bad during the early-rush hour until recently. It would be hit or miss at 4pm, but not EVERY single day.

….about 15 years ago. It hasn't been this bad during the early-rush hour until recently. It would be hit or miss at 4pm, but not EVERY single day.

I've noticed the same thing this week. It's probably just the increased activity at the interchange. Like you, my past experience has been that it didn't get *that* backed up until closer to 5:00 unless there was a wreck or something.

EVERY single afternoon for the past week or so, 235-Northbound traffic is bottlenecked over the bridge. It is really causing traffic to back up on 235. I am there pretty early - around 4pm everyday. Unfortunately, I really do not have alternative besides taking side streets.

If coming from south and its jacked up get off at 10th go east to Lincoln and take to 44w and back on 235n there. You have lights but its consistent so it just depends on how bad 235 is backed up if its worth the detour.

If you have never taken this way do it once just to practice so you know the difference

Many people naturally slow down when they have barriers in place where a little bit of shoulder room once was. Though the lane width hasn't changed, there are now no shoulders at all and walls that guide us through the zone.

Many people naturally slow down when they have barriers in place where a little bit of shoulder room once was. Though the lane width hasn't changed, there are now no shoulders at all and walls that guide us through the zone.

Thats true. Plus workers are right there working just feet on other side. Prior work had workers further away.

Once drivers get a bit used to it flow will be slightly better but there is less merging room which creates panic to some drivers and then full stop due to indecision between drivers merging and already there.

1.5 more years and it will be over. And with luck they can finish earlier for some extra $$$.

Thats true. Plus workers are right there working just feet on other side. Prior work had workers further away.

Once drivers get a bit used to it flow will be slightly better but there is less merging room which creates panic to some drivers and then full stop due to indecision between drivers merging and already there.

1.5 more years and it will be over. And with luck they can finish earlier for some extra $$$.

It may get a little better after this week once their done fully diverting everything.

It may get a little better after this week once their done fully diverting everything.

The 63rd ramp should be reopened fully later this month I think? They had to put in a large drain or something so thats why only one lane exit plus it took merging room away I think.

And familiarity helps. However once school starts back up thats more drivers on roads so expect it to get bad again then.

They shifted southbound lanes to the original northbound (west) side and S goes under 63rd on East side of pillars. Stays side by side with Northbound (concrete divided) and then moves back to normal south lanes to cross 44. Flow seems better or same.

They shifted southbound lanes to the original northbound (west) side and S goes under 63rd on East side of pillars. Stays side by side with Northbound (concrete divided) and then moves back to normal south lanes to cross 44. Flow seems better or same.

It seemed significantly better.

Pete,

Do you plan on taking anymore updated drone pics of this area? I'd love to see how it currently looks!

From this morning (Sunday).

Right-click and open in a new window/tab for hi-res.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/23544063019a.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/23544063019b.jpg