Just curious, does Ellard have experience developing on this scale? Who is her development team and what experience do they have? If the only thing she's done is the Sieber, that is a pretty small project vs. this kind of project. I don't mean to imply she isn't capable, but just wondering what her and her team's real credentials are. She has many supporters on this site and I am wondering if it is merited. I personally think here project composition is good, but the design looks very institutional.

I am also curious why no one has commented at the apparent finishes of stucco or fake stucco. It has been a big issue previously by Ellard's design is given a pass?

Kerry, I only wish I had the means to develop one myself lol, I was just asking hypothetically. You're right though, I suppose any vacant lot would be good...

Maybe we need to form an OKCTALK real-estate development company. We have lawyers, engineers, construction professional, land owners, real-estate experts, architects, and willing tennants. Start small and work our way up.

Ellard was one of the original partners of The Hill. Not sure about her partners on this project.

She has been on the board for Preservation Oklahoma for years and is an officer in the Midtown Association. She also lives very nearby this property in Heritage Hills.

Generally, people trust her because 1) she seems to understand the needs in this area of town; 2) loves Oklahoma City and has done a lot for it that hasn't involved her making money and 3) seems to put quality first.

As far as her project being stucco, it's hard to tell from the renderings. EIFS/stucco isn't necessarily evil if it's done correctly (Level Apartments and the new Aloft have not drawn much criticism) and I think anyone that knows Marva knows she does things right.

Just curious, does Ellard have experience developing on this scale? Who is her development team and what experience do they have? If the only thing she's done is the Sieber, that is a pretty small project vs. this kind of project. I don't mean to imply she isn't capable, but just wondering what her and her team's real credentials are. She has many supporters on this site and I am wondering if it is merited. I personally think here project composition is good, but the design looks very institutional.

I am also curious why no one has commented at the apparent finishes of stucco or fake stucco. It has been a big issue previously by Ellard's design is given a pass?

I have yet to understand the big problem with using stucco as an exterior building material? It seems like its much more of a buzzword than anything, as most people do not understand it.
EIFS is basically the same thing as stucco and most people cannot tell the difference unless they physically touch it. Obviously stucco is a little better. Theres tons of really cool buildings all over the world that use stucco. As I said, I think they are both buzzwords people use without really knowing what it is. I never hear any mention of faux stone that is commonly used either. Probably because nobody notices it... Its all in the design whether or not a building looks cheap and cookie cutter.

In talking to Marva I do not believe there is any stucco. She mentioned thin stone and brick.
Yes her team has extensive development experience.

I have yet to understand the big problem with using stucco as an exterior building material? It seems like its much more of a buzzword than anything, as most people do not understand it.
EIFS is basically the same thing as stucco and most people cannot tell the difference unless they physically touch it. Obviously stucco is a little better. Theres tons of really cool buildings all over the world that use stucco. As I said, I think they are both buzzwords people use without really knowing what it is. I never hear any mention of faux stone that is commonly used either. Probably because nobody notices it... Its all in the design whether or not a building looks cheap and cookie cutter.

I don't think anyone has a problem with stucco as a building material. Done properly, it is a very durable exterior material. EIFS, in my opinion, does not hold up well. If you look at buildings that are 10 to 20 years old constructed of EIFS, they don't age well, especially in the lighter colors builders seem to favor. Brick is my personal favorite, because it looks as good old as new.

In talking to Marva I do not believe there is any stucco. She mentioned thin stone and brick.
Yes her team has extensive development experience.

So what are some of the relevant or similar projects her team has direct leadership experience with the development? If you can name them we can view them.

Thanks.

In talking to Marva I do not believe there is any stucco. She mentioned thin stone and brick.
Yes her team has extensive development experience.

Translation: faux

My Rankings: POSITIVES in Bold, NEGATIVES in Red.

1) Best design however I agree about the reservations mentioned by others: bait and switch, initial rendering already doesn't match the 'written' proposal (6 storey but 4 storey shown. ...), pitched roof, past 'failure' to implement Legacy to initial proposal/design. However, this is still the most urban and best capitalizes the Mercy site and that is why I rank it first. And excellent VALUE request for TIF.

We should put in a condition on the final permit that if there is a change from the written proposal/dates that it could be immediately disqualified with PENALTY! I think that should stop this BS and 'developers' looking to use OKC for their 'starts'.


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/mercy/mercyhenderson.jpg

• Cornerstone Development (The Edge)
Led by Mike Henderson and Gary Brooks
Proposal: Six stories, includes a mix of retail, with a rooftop terrace and dog park, 500-space garage, featuring 250 rental units with monthly rates between $735 and $1,395.
Cost: $28,219,041
Proposal land purchase: $850,000
Requested tax increment financing assistance: $1.5 million



2) This would be ranked higher if it were 6+ storeys and 200+ units. I LOVE the underground garage treatment. The developer seems to be top knotch as people have mentioned, BUT I honestly like this development in a different area - closer to the Federal Building/CBD (due to the hotel) and still want to see it at 6+ floors (particularly the hotel portion).


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/mercy/mercyellard.jpg
• Mercy Redevelopers
Led by Marva Ellard
Proposal: Four stories, includes a mix of retail, with a gym, pool, rooftop terrace, underground 300-space garage, featuring 150 rental units.
Cost: $31,310,000
Proposed land purchase: $951,949
Requested tax increment financing assistance: $2.2 million



3) As others have noted, this is not particularly impressive but it is arguably the most urban. Does seem to be lacking and should be taller than 5 storeys for the cost. ...

There are other significant downsides: cost way too much and request way too much TIFF, retail/restaurant seems ambiguous, Wiggins had the site before and did nothing; we could create a similar 'disqualification' amendment like what I proposed for Henderson so the site doesn't 'sit' or the project isn't switched.

I would like to see this (as designed) probably at another 'smaller' site nearby.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/mercy/mercywiggin.jpg

• Wiggin Properties
Led by Chuck Wiggin
Proposal: Five-story building with 24,000 square feet for restaurants and retail, a 375-car garage, featuring 200 rental units with monthly rates between $600 and $1,900.
Cost: $42,631,596
Proposed land purchase: $1 million
Requested tax increment financing assistance: $3.5 million




..

..


4) Suburban. Nice, but not for downtown. ... Enough said. No TIFF and seems to be reasonable cost. .. Put it in 63rd/Chesapeake. ...


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/mercy/mercygth.jpg

• GTH (The Connection)
Led by Richard and Stephen Tanenbaum
Proposal: Four-story building featuring 268 rental units with pool and courtyard.
Cost: $20,408,124
Proposed land purchase: $557,568


...


...


...


5) This should be considered for the suburbs. .... This is not a solid DOWNTOWN development, does he doubt the downtown market or is he an elementary developer with no capital/cash? Downtown is way past Deep Deuce Apartments, so there is no reason for the 'phased' and 'considerations'.

We aren't a test market. I would deny it outright without consideration, let MWC or Edmond or the Southside have it. ...
[QUOTE=Pete Brzycki;411428]http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/mercy/mercyhome.jpg

• Home Creations
Led by Jamal Farzaneh
Proposal: (Two options, both to be built in two phases with the second phase “subject to certain factors”). Option one: 160 residential units, 20 percent rental, 80 percent for sale, with 68,000 square feet set for office or commercial tenants and an underground 220-space garage. Option two: 64 rental and 16 for-sale units with 18,000 square feet set for office space, half rental, half for-sale, 120 parking spaces.
Cost: Option one, first phase $11,434,000, second phase, $7,690,000. Option two, first phase $6,490,000, second phase $5,740,000.
Proposed land purchase: $552,000
Requested tax increment financing assistance: none listed

3 to 4 stories is the new design ordinance height restriction for Midtown. Maybe that will be waived but I am sure Marva and Tanenbaum knew that and the others did not.

Since we are really talking preliminary opinions here, and without a heck of a lot of data or, for that matter, design appearance, either, and no floor plans, schematics, or site plans at all, my preliminary thoughts are:

(1) I'd toss out 3 from the get-go: Henderson & Wiggin based on unsatisfactory previous experiences (need I be more specific?) and Home Creations whose design looks like it belongs in Edmond, not to mention that I wholly distrust having "phases," the second of which may never get done.

(2) For me, that leaves 2: Ellard's & Tanenbaum's. I think that both have good track records but I very much appreciate Marva Ellard's personal devotion to historic preservation issues and I am more than impressed with her great job on the Sieber, and those qualities give her a personal edge over Tanenbaum with me. However, I can't tell from Ellard's image what the overall design might be like and I'd want to see that before making my vote between these two. I do like Tanenbaum's image and I think he did a fine job with the Wards building. I give him no design points on the Park Harvey but no demerits either since design restrictions inhibited much if any room for design creativity. As far as I know, his Citizens Tower makeover has gone well, but, again, I give no plus or minus points for design ... it is basically, what it was. Tanenbaum's "plus" for me is that he appears to move quickly and get the job done quickly. I have to disagree with you, Hot Rod, about Tanenbaum's design being suburban. Actually, the design reminds me of the original Hadden Hall, shown below in 1912 and I think that it blends in well with the time period that many surrounding structures were built, both north and south of NW 13th.

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/miscbuildings/1912haddenhall215nw10.jpg

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/mercy/mercygth.jpg

The number of rental units isn't a big deal with me ... Ellards' 150 compared to Tanenbaum's 268, particularly when noting that Ellard's proposal includes more features (a mix of retail, with a gym, pool, rooftop terrace, underground 300-space garage) than does Tanenbaum's (pool and courtyard). Plus, there are several other midtown areas for this type of development, as Pete pointed out so very well. All eggs do not have to be in one basket.

I'll pass on voting further until more is presented on both the Ellard & Tanenbaum proposals.

Classen and Lincoln would look really good with a lot of these.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/mercy/mercygth.jpg

ok, how about semi-suburban, then. ....

:)

It's not bad, I just think we should demand better for downtown and let this type of development go elsewhere in the 'outer' inner-city, such as Kerry mentions and NOT anything below 13th Street were we need to be pushing mid-rise, density, build-to-property line, flat roofs, mixed-use.

In my opinion, we should be pushing for mid-rise density starting at 30th street or 23rd, but I'd settle for 13th street for now.

The extension of Classen Drive was proposed several years ago and supposedly financed by a general obligation bond. Have no idea about the current status.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/mercy/classenext.jpg

It is proceeding forward. This is one major project that affected our streetcar routing. We looked into it extensively. It will be done when the bonds are let.

So my guess, maybe 3-5 years? It sounds a though city staff is pretty distracted right now. lol

This extension has been canceled because the land cost (primarily the dry cleaner location) shot thru the roof. It would have been nice.

If it has, then it is new news. It was brought back up by the Planning Director at one of our Alternatives Analysis meetings recently. Do you have some information reference? Not doubting the dry cleaner story about costs. Those things are usually Brownfields and that is a functioning business.

I like the bigger Cornerstone project a lot. Dislike the smaller Cornerstone project tremendously. Wiggin's looks alright, Home Creations is interesting... I wonder if they might be interested in some other blocks? That would be very appropriate for some of the blocks further west in Mid-town.

Is there a reference location for more information on the projects? Particularly more renderings than just one vantage point of each one.

3 to 4 stories is the new design ordinance height restriction for Midtown. Maybe that will be waived but I am sure Marva and Tanenbaum knew that and the others did not.

The previous "winner" of this site was 8 stories. When did the new height restrictions take effect?

http://www.downtownokc.com/Default.aspx?tabid=191&newsid637=53&

New renderings of Marva Ellard's proposal on OKC Central:

http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2011/03/11/delving-deeper-into-bids-for-the-former-mercy-hospital-site-in-midtown/mercy-redevelopers-030711-2/

It looks like 3 levels of parking. In the summary it says underground parking but in the site plan 2/3 of the parking is above ground. I don't really care for the interior drive either. It serves no purpose what so ever. It doesn't have parking and it doesn't lead to parking.

New renderings of Marva Ellard's proposal on OKC Central:

http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2011/03/11/delving-deeper-into-bids-for-the-former-mercy-hospital-site-in-midtown/mercy-redevelopers-030711-2/
Thanks for that link. Here are the images contained in the PDF file, pages 1 through 11, complete.

Page 1 - Interior grounds looking southwesterly
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_01.jpg

Page 2 - Street level - includes courtyard, middle interior parking level, gym & day care
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_02.jpg

Page 3 - 2nd story - includes 2 laundries, upper parking level, gym & day care
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_03.jpg

Page 4 - 3rd story - includes 2 laundries, 2 storage areas, pool & clubhouse
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_04.jpg

Page 5 - 4th story - includes some roof decks; open view of the pool area and the courtyard
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_05.jpg

Page 6 - Basement - includes lower parking level
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_06.jpg

Page 7 - this one puzzles me - would have to be Walker looking west or Dewey looking east,
but does not match with either page 10 or page 11 showing those views
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_07.jpg

Page 8 - Looking north from NW 12th Street
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_08.jpg

Page 9 - Looking south from NW 13th Street
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_09.jpg

Page 10 - Looking east from Dewey
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_10.jpg

Page 11 - Looking west from Walker
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_11.jpg

This looks very good to me. I look forward to seeing similar detail about the other proposals, particularly Tanenbaum's.

It is proceeding forward. This is one major project that affected our streetcar routing. We looked into it extensively. It will be done when the bonds are let.

So my guess, maybe 3-5 years? It sounds a though city staff is pretty distracted right now. lol

Do you know which bond issue this is from? Am thinking it might be from one of the 3 previous ones before the 2007 GO bond where an audit showed there were several bond projects that never got built (some going back 18 years at the time of the audit). The "excuse" from the City Manager at the time? The City had "higher priorities" (MAPS) and also some non-sense about not having anyone to supervise.

I'm no architect, but I'd love to see more underground parking and more lease-able space on top. It seems that much of the lot is devoted to the parking structure. I like the overall design, though. I think it would look great in midtown.

I don't really care if there is retail in the mix at this point. I think midtown already has a good amount of retail space available. Until we see several more large infill residential projects, I'm not certain midtown will support more retail.

I sure wish they could squeeze a couple more floors into the project. I think 4 floors is simply too low for urban core development. I realize they must be kind to Heritage Hills, but couldn't we extend it to 6 floors?

Page 7 - this one puzzles me - would have to be Walker looking west or Dewey looking east,
but does not match with either page 10 or page 11 showing those views
http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/MercyRedevelopment/ellard_07.jpg



I think that is the view from the park and pond looking west towards Dewey.

Good eyes, Kerry. That's gotta be it. You can see green thingies hanging down from the top of the 3rd floor/bottom of 4th where the swimming pool & lounge areas are located. The pool must not be very deep.

Sorry, I can't figure out how to imbed the photos; copy and paste doesn't work and I can't upload the image as an attachment.

More renderings on OKC Central of Wiggin's and Henderson's respective proposals:

http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/

Two elevations of Henderson's plan are now posted at okccentral.com as well. If I'm reading the plans correctly, two sides of Henderson's plan are parking garage. As I said on Steve's blog, as far as I'm concerned, he should be a nonstarter, as we would have absolutely no idea what he would actually build if he got the goahead. And, if it were me, I wouldn't want Legacy to be my legacy. I don't want to see what any of his other ideas translate to.

I'm no architect, but I'd love to see more underground parking and more lease-able space on top. It seems that much of the lot is devoted to the parking structure.

Having underground parking would be nice but it's just not feasible for a project this size. It's not common for most similar projects in other cities and the extra costs would be considerable.

Did Marva Ellard put a jihad on your family?

No, I like her project a lot, I just didn't have time to review the pdf on that one because I was in Amsterdam. There are three serious contenders I think, and interestingly Tanenbaum isn't one in my opinion, and it may come down to the trustworthiness of the applicants. If it's being evaluated by architectural standards and by the best planning merit, I think Wiggin's rises to the front.

But I do think there are questions about whether Wiggin or Henderson should be trusted. But keep in mind, even while Wiggin was waffling on Overholser Green, he was still pulling off successful projects in Tulsa, like the 420 Mayo one. And Wiggin has been a successful developer in the past, he just couldn't get a project full of Frasier-like flats off the ground here...

But I do think there are questions about whether Wiggin or Henderson should be trusted. But keep in mind, even while Wiggin was waffling on Overholser Green, he was still pulling off successful projects in Tulsa, like the 420 Mayo one. And Wiggin has been a successful developer in the past, he just couldn't get a project full of Frasier-like flats off the ground here...

And if he had, everyone here would be criticizing him for thinking he could sell flats, when we all know only rental will succeed!

But keep in mind, even while Wiggin was waffling on Overholser Green, he was still pulling off successful projects in Tulsa, like the 420 Mayo one. And Wiggin has been a successful developer in the past, he just couldn't get a project full of Frasier-like flats off the ground here...
My thoughts exactly.. I think he thought he had a free option on the citizens money until he was good and ready to do something. I feel he took advantage BIG TIME.

And if he had, everyone here would be criticizing him for thinking he could sell flats, when we all know only rental will succeed!

It's hard to say how much the market has improved and how many of these upscale condo units it would be able to support right now.

Not many. Still don't think okc is able to support many $200+/ft condos. Too many cheaper houses nearby and commuting to downtown is still fairly easy and quick. Not many reasons for people to drop that much on a condo.

Nice gated zero lot areas in suburban OKC go for $175-$250 a foot now. With the right designs and amenities, the condo's will sell.

Nice gated zero lot areas in suburban OKC go for $175-$250 a foot now. With the right designs and amenities, the condo's will sell.

Then why arent the current ones like that selling well now? And those are some expensive zero lot homes

Then why arent the current ones like that selling well now? And those are some expensive zero lot homes

The designs don't cater to those willing to spend that much. Product offering and market requirement doesn't match.

Its uncertainty over how the area is going to develop and how property values will fare more than design. Even if statistically you can prove that a higher percentage of people in that price range prefer a different design, it doesn't begin to approach 100%. If nothing else, Block 42 and Central Ave villas have flats, and those aren't exactly flying off the shelves. I think it's as much the economy and uncertainty Bout a more urban lifestyle. It may even be the grocery store. Design is far too simplistic an answer.

Actually, the flats at Block 42 sold really quickly. The inventory is pretty much all townhouses. I bet if they had to do it over again they would have done all flats.

Its uncertainty over how the area is going to develop and how property values will fare more than design. Even if statistically you can prove that a higher percentage of people in that price range prefer a different design, it doesn't begin to approach 100%. If nothing else, Block 42 and Central Ave villas have flats, and those aren't exactly flying off the shelves. I think it's as much the economy and uncertainty Bout a more urban lifestyle. It may even be the grocery store. Design is far too simplistic an answer.

I think it's all of the above, and yes I agree with the point you left out that these are all weak reasons, but all that can be said is I suppose there is a higher level of scrutiny and concern when you're investing $500,000+ into real estate. I hope that's a fair assumption that we can all agree on.

I hope that we can all agree that it would be nice to pick up the pace with development. The concerns that Betts mentions aren't going to be alleviated overnight, and they're going to continue to linger while upscale units would slowly be developed and even slower, but eventually, sell. Whereas we're fairly certain that upper-middle class apartments or more affordable condos would sell very quickly. We need some of that action. I think that for the concern over land values, having LEVEL or another upper-middle class apartment complex next door is infinitely more attractive than a mud pit.

I do think that building up the level of density has to be the concern. Downtown's housing market will continue to mature slowly and as that happens, the amenities and styles that Rover and Kerry and others might at some point be looking for, will naturally find their way into downtown. Just keep pursuing development and eventually some of the projects will offer those upscale alternatives.

Its uncertainty over how the area is going to develop and how property values will fare more than design. Even if statistically you can prove that a higher percentage of people in that price range prefer a different design, it doesn't begin to approach 100%. If nothing else, Block 42 and Central Ave villas have flats, and those aren't exactly flying off the shelves. I think it's as much the economy and uncertainty Bout a more urban lifestyle. It may even be the grocery store. Design is far too simplistic an answer.

Actually design and lifestyle has very much to do with it. Summarily dismissing it as an argument is a simple answer. Neither of the projects you point out with flats represent much of what is being sold to that particular demographic in other places. Mid rise and up towers with secure entries, door-men, valet, underground parking, spas, etc. sell in other markets and we have no building like that outside of Founders, and Founders struggles because the floor plans are awkward as they are offices converted to condos. Now I do agree that location and uncertainty also contribute greatly, as well as prestige, etc. People don't want to lose their money if the neighborhood becomes an urban slum and they don't want to be associated with an urban slum. So how the whole area is perceived is very important, as you point out. Mercy site won't have quite the same problem as Heritage Hills is established and protects it on the North.

Does anyone legitimately think Deep Deuce or Mid-town will become an "urban slum?"

Where does this idea/fear keep coming from??

Does anyone legitimately think Deep Deuce or Mid-town will become an "urban slum?"

Where does this idea/fear keep coming from??

I think the McMansion neighborhoods will become urban slums before either of them. Just my strong impression. McMansions can be converted to duplexes and fourplexes for "normal" folks.

Does anyone legitimately think Deep Deuce or Mid-town will become an "urban slum?"

Where does this idea/fear keep coming from??

Didn't mean to imply that either is an urban slum, but they are both pretty early in their development and at various times could have gone more upscale or more downscale. When investing in an area, most people don't want the most expensive home on the block...they would rather further development around them to be greater than what the have to help escalate their value.

Actually design and lifestyle has very much to do with it. Summarily dismissing it as an argument is a simple answer. Neither of the projects you point out with flats represent much of what is being sold to that particular demographic in other places. Mid rise and up towers with secure entries, door-men, valet, underground parking, spas, etc. sell in other markets and we have no building like that outside of Founders, and Founders struggles because the floor plans are awkward as they are offices converted to condos.

Then what design do you have in mind? I dont think the floorplans at Founders were that awkward. If there is any awkwardness it is made up in the panoramic views it provides. I think the Founders struggles were less from the floor plans you mention but more because of the prices, very top of the market. But thats what happens when you have secure entries, door men, valet, spas etc that you mention. And I wouldnt see it much different downtown, highrises are very expensive to build and live in. Theres a small market of potential renters right now.

Didn't mean to imply that either is an urban slum, but they are both pretty early in their development and at various times could have gone more upscale or more downscale. When investing in an area, most people don't want the most expensive home on the block...they would rather further development around them to be greater than what the have to help escalate their value.

That sounds like wanting something from nothing to me.

That sounds like wanting something from nothing to me.

No, it sounds like reality and a little less naivety.

I think the McMansion neighborhoods will become urban slums before either of them.

That already happens. This is the problem with sprawl. Instead of maintaining their homes, the people that can afford to move to the next great new subdivision leaving behind one that just grows older and gets more run down, usually due to renters and in the recent past - sub-prime borrowers. About 6 years after we moved from Tampa I had a chance to go back and see the old house. We were the original owners and kept it what I like to call "Disney quality". Everything was always kept immaculate, and not just by me, but by all the homeowners.

I was shocked upon my return. It looked like a bomb went off. Trees were not pruned, grass wasn't mowed, there were weeds growing in the sidewalk joints, mailboxes were falling off (or down), homes were painted every color of the rainbow, nearly every driveway had oil leak stains, and cars were parked in the grass. I was in shock and awe when I saw our old house. I am pretty sure I was the last person that had worked in that yard and I had been gone 6 years.

Are there more renderings of Tannenbaum's proposal? His has the most units right? The singular rendering I've seen doesn't seem to suggest how that's being accomplished.

Check out Steve's most recent post at his blog. It seems there are some serious shenanigans going down at the Urban Renewal Authority by someone who is trying to discredit Marva Ellard's plan or someone just did an inexplicably terrible job writing that report.

http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2011/04/18/more-intrigue-on-the-midtown-mercy-hospital-property/

Seems like everyone on this board is a pro Marva Ellard with others not so much. If anyone other than Ellard gets it we will live through months or years of hearing about how she got gypped. I don't personally think hers was the strongest design, but I hope she gets it so we can quiet the conspiracy crowd.

Seems like everyone on this board is a pro Marva Ellard with others not so much. If anyone other than Ellard gets it we will live through months or years of hearing about how she got gypped. I don't personally think hers was the strongest design, but I hope she gets it so we can quiet the conspiracy crowd.

Good point. I'm not pro- or anti- Marva. I was just reacting to Steve's post that seems to indicate either someone is trying to swing any favor away from her or it was just poorly written. I don't care who is chosen as long as we get a good design and strong build that contributes to the surrounding environment and city. And I certainly don't want this to become another source of conspiracy theories, which are often destructive to confidence in our city.

I liked Chuck Wiggin's design best, but Marva Ellard's was certainly good enough to be in the discussion. My worry is that OCURA is dumb enough to fall for the smoke and mirrors of Henderson's design. "Fooled me once" don't really seem to be the watchwords here.

I think whichever is best for the development of OKC and midtown is the one chosen. If that happens to be Henderson's, I hope we have the wisdom to put many and early benchmarks in place and require solid proof of ability to get it done without changes. Everyone has negatives and bait and switch seems to be Henderson's.

http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2011/04/18/more-intrigue-on-the-midtown-mercy-hospital-property/


I asked Urban Renewal director JoeVan Bullard to let me attend the committee discussion. I was denied the request on the basis of the old excuse of needing to foster a “free and open discussion” and that I’d get in the way of that

If they can only be open and honest in the absence of outside ears, what are they doing the rest of the time when someone is listening?

i just hope that whomever they chose they require retail along walker

I was browsing the OCURA website (www.ocura.com) and it appears that everything is on the "up and up" with the Mercy proposals.

I was browsing the OCURA website (www.ocura.com) and it appears that everything is on the "up and up" with the Mercy proposals.

That is awesome.

I was browsing the OCURA website (www.ocura.com) and it appears that everything is on the "up and up" with the Mercy proposals.

I knew OCURA was evil all along.

NEWS ALERT: A special meeting of OCURA will occur on Monday, May 16, 2011. It will convene at 8:00 a.m. in the PHF Conference Center’s Colloquim Room at 655 Research Parkway.




The Mercy Redevelopment Teams presentation times are follows.

8:00 to 8:40 Mercy Redevelopers, LLC (Marva Ellard's proposal)
8:50 to 9:30 Wiggins Properties, LLC
9:40 to 10:20 Cornerstone-Midtown, LLC
10:30 to 11:10 Gardner Tanenbaum Group

The memo to the above contestants says, "The Commissioner’s agenda remains limited, thus Redevelopment Teams need to be cognizant of their allocated time and prepare accordingly for a 25 minute presentation and 15 minutes to respond to questions."

The Conference Center will open at 7:30 a.m. and the meeting is open to the public.

That's the same place they has the meeting where they chose The Hill "at Bricktown" over the other better proposals. Hopefully the fate of their last big meeting there doesn't carry over.

If you haven't seen it, Steve Lackmeyer did a great job covering the project presentations at www.okccentral.com.