#7 on best states for young people! While I would say we do have a lack of nightspots, it is improving, kinda.

Best States for Young People from MoneyRates.com (http://www.money-rates.com/research-center/best-states-for-young-adults/)

#7 on best states for young people! While I would say we do have a lack of nightspots, it is improving, kinda.

Best States for Young People from MoneyRates.com (http://www.money-rates.com/research-center/best-states-for-young-adults/)

Low cost of living so you dont have to live in a broom closet and eat ramen while you're young and getting on your feet.

Interesting that these are all small population states, with OKC being the largest city in all of the states in the ranking.

We need to work on our nightlife offerability, as I (and Bchris) said, a great city has lots to offer so that a person has choices available to him/her. Nightclubs = singles hotspots. Just need them to be upscale and high quality to keep the riff-raff out.

Low cost of living so you dont have to live in a broom closet and eat ramen while you're young and getting on your feet.

Meh, I think it should be a bit more important to be just "cheap." There are plenty of cheap places in this country, although a good majority of them are unliviable or have completely decimated economies.

Are there job opportunities? Is there at least a decent quality of life? Is the climate okay? Are the basic trappings of life at least somewhat obtainable by a person with decent means? I would ask these questions before I would ask how cheap stuff is. Just my 0.02.

I read an article in The Oklahoman this morning about articles that are appearing in the in-flight magazines of both, American and United. Pretty cool to see Oklahoma City being given publicity to millions of travellers. And both have great shots of downtown (United's Dossier's shot is pretty awesome in fact; it covers not only OKC but the state in general). Not to mention they have covered OKC in a great, positive light.

Here is the article in "American Way":

Cinderella City (http://hub.aa.com/en/aw/cinderella-city)

United's "Dossier", focusing on Oklahoma/Oklahoma City:

Hemispheres Dossier (http://ink-live.com/emagazines/hemispheres-dossier/1735/october-2014/#6)

I haven't read United's in completely yet but from the ads/photos and what I've read so far it appears to be pretty awesome as well. :)

beat me to it, hats off to the airlines. Maybe they'll throw OKC a bone with at least service to all of their hubs (where missing). :)

I read the United feature and it was great and all but I do have some observations:

- SPOILER ALERT!!!!!! -

1) OKC pics seemed to try to omit Chase Tower
2) Tulsa ads were thrown in all over the place, disturbing the message. Should have had the Tulsa stuff in the Tulsa section.
3) the article seemed to be Tulsa oriented or at least trying to boast Tulsa at the expense of OKC. For example, in the OKC section there were several Tulsa pics and ads (whereas there were NO OKC pics/ads in the Tulsa section). To me this is very tacky and so illustrates the attitude many Tulsans have when OKC is in the spotlight, as in "Hey, remember us - we're pretty and in Oklahoma too. Yeah, OKC 'might' have that but look at us. ...."
4) Fallin highlighted as a positive? ??? ONLY if you consider finally having a female governor IMO.
5) The article was too economic focused, like trying to PROVE something (particularly the incessant Tulsa ads all over the place). Instead, I think the article should have spent time on the human aspects of OKC and Tulsa more (and in their own section). OKC has done great things to make the city liveable but there was only a casual, cavalier mention of this (with a Tulsa ad/pic to boot).
6) There are more impressive pics of OKC's skyline than just the SW facing one (shown twice, in large print). The shot from Bricktown (TNT/NBA famous) is one and the SE facing (from Midtown) is also impressive. Variety is the key.
7) The economic focus was far too Energy. I'm not saying it shouldn't have that much focus, but there was little to no mention of anything else going on in OKC; including corporate relocations, health care/services at the OHC, retail expansion, downtown hospitality expansion, manufacturing expansion, and no mention of the MAPS projects and at least an opinion of how it will impact downtown's future economy or the city's continued renaissance.
8) no construction highlights. OKC has a plethora going on right now but no mention. Tulsa has momentum building but again, no mention.
9) a glance over of the Oklahoma River district. Should have had some details of the master plan and perhaps local reaction to what's already there.
10) there was no finance. I am a finance guy and typically these type of articles need some pie charts/graphs showing the numbers. If the actual nominal data is not as impressive then you could instead focus on margin to help illustrate growth. I believe OKC is not only among the top 5 fastest growing large cities in the US but also its economy expanded by a similar ranking YoY and since 2010. The industry graph was nice but it was sterile and not very informative. Add in a few supporting charts/graphs along with some of the ranking accolades OKC has been receiving as of late and that would have been MUCH MORE impressive.


As a native Oklahoman, I am happy that the city and state is getting exposure like this. Lots of people will have the opportunity to learn more about the OKC economy and Oklahoma as a state (and even see a bit of the Tulsa jealousy thrown in and get confused as I was on the POINT of the article).

However, as a professional I take away that the state has a LONG way before it could compete against others with more punch or more to offer. The STATE needs to get behind OKC as the city has an impressive story and is building world class infrastructure and amenities that should have been highlighted SEPARATELY. Tulsa certainly has a place and should be featured as well (in a state article) but it should be in SUPPORT of OKC and not trying to outshine or out-do it.

Again, even though I am FROM Oklahoma and understand the historical Tulsa arrogance, I tried to read the article with an open mind but still came away that whoever put this together did not really know or understand what's going on in OKC (or just didn't care nor appreciate it) and instead wanted to use OKC's success (for the state) to pimp Tulsa. If we can't do a proper, constructive article featuring the state then I think it is best for OKC to stand on its own in situations like this as it would have been a much better read and would have portrayed the state much better than what was put together for United. My opinion.

SPOILER ALERT II

The American story (and pics) were much better IMO than the United one in that at least the theme was consistent and a person could learn a lot from it. There were no inserts from another city to throw off the point, pics were timely, varied, professional, and appropriate, and there was plenty of local prospective on the city's transformation.

However, there are constructive takeaways even from this article that I'd like to make. First, at some point OKC is going to have to limit or at least shorten its message when describing the creation of MAPS. It is so depressing to keep reading over and over, three or 4 paragraphs about it. IMO it really showcases OKC's lackluster image and some people will stop reading if we continue to chirp along about the past. Can we come up with a one or two paragraph about the 'desolate early 1990s' and leave it at that? Move forward to showcasing the city of today? I mean, that was 25 years ago and OKC needs to convince people - who likely already have that impression of the city - that it has indeed moved on with this, and that, and so on. Norick is great for the history of OKC and schools should have his story about the city as required curriculum, but business people and non-OKC people need to know what the city has to offer now not necessarily focus on what it took to get started. ..

My second point feeds off the first and that is we need to focus more on OKC landmarks. Landmark buildings of significance, landmark institutions of significance, landmark events, landmark proposals, landmark attractions etc. What WoW factor can OKC present to a prospective tourist or businessman reading on an airplane that would convince him/her to give the city a chance look? IMO, Tulsa does this very well with their ads about their museums, shopping, and culture; OKC needs to figure this out and not just the same old "50 legendary attractions" crap. If I had only ONE day in OKC, what should I definitely not miss and now shape that into a simple one page ad (like Tulsa's) which could be used as a baseline and expanded upon if the city gets another article. There needs to be a consistent message other than a boring, uninspiring, stagnating city in the 1990's took a look at itself and other peer cities and said "ENOUGH, let's tax ourselves (even though we're Republican by the way) to bring on large scale civic QoL elements". Again, that is for the history books IMO, we need a story that shows OKC today and the future with a very quick, section appropriate mention about how we started/got there.

IMO, if we incorporate these two ideas, the American article would have been perfect and showcased the city as a hip, happening place that people should give a chance. My advice, OKC leaders/citizens need to shake the inferiority complex regarding the Grapes of Wrath (the original and the early 1990s) and instead focus on the WHAT the incredible renaissance has brought and will continue in the future. Now that's a story to be told and if someone wants the history they can read something ELSE for details of Norick's 'aha moment'.

I agree, the Tulsa ads were way overdone and do disturb the message. The Tulsa inferiority complex really came across strong and tacky.

It reminds me of the kind of thing I always see on the City-Data forum. Any time a potential re-locator asks a question or has something positive to say about OKC, the resident Tulsa posters come in and rip OKC to shreds and then boost Tulsa. One time recently somebody asked a question about what to do during a weekend stuck in OKC and of course the Tulsa people were saying there is nothing to do in OKC and they should just drive to Tulsa. It really is a strange attitude and arrogance some people have at that end of the turnpike.

It's because that place sucks. Was just up there today, go figure, and couldn't wait to leave.

It's because that place sucks. Was juts up there today, go figure, and couldn't wait to leave.

Don't they have a billboard that says "Tulsa class OKC..." somewhere near their downtown? I could swear I saw it at some point.

Don't they have a billboard that says "Tulsa class OKC..." somewhere near their downtown? I could swear I saw it at some point.

That seems more like a message scrawled in graffiti, than in an ad someone would pay money for.

Don't they have a billboard that says "Tulsa class OKC..." somewhere near their downtown? I could swear I saw it at some point.
I've heard the phrase Tulsa class OKC trash. Didn't know if it was actually posted by legitimate means or not. I'd even be against a billboard in OKC that shamed Tulsa in elementary tactics.

Read both pieces. Nobody is going to win a Pulitzer Prize here, but otherwise good publicity that tailors well to the target crowd (high end business travelers looking for a quick and interesting read). I hope its the start of better marketing by both the city and the state, which are both lacking IMO.

As far as the United Dossier, I agree the Tulsa ads are kinda overdone and oddly placed, but hey that's how these things make money. The coverage was well balanced between the two cities. I am frankly a bit stunned they mentioned little to nothing about Tinker, the largest employer in the state and one that is in rapid expansion thanks to the KC 135 project. With that in mind, I find it a bit unfair to say Tulsa and the rest of the state should "get behind" OKC. I am much more bullish on the future of OKC, but last time I checked people in Tulsa still pay state taxes. Don't they deserve as much of a shake as we do?

no, because they don't pay as much since OKC is larger and has a larger base. Fact is fact.


Every state has a largest city for a reason and that is for it to prosper and go against other state's (usually their largest city). Again, I'm not talking about OKC vs Tulsa competing as cities, I'm talking about OKLAHOMA promoting itself as a state. OK should lean heavily on OKC since it is rightfully so the state's shining star. It is foolish not to. And was foolish to allow a national audience to see how backwater the state is by allowing Tulsa to pre-empt OKC. This wouldn't happen in any other state that Im aware of; and this 'bush league' stuff must stop.


If OKC and Tulsa are direct competitors as cities, I could see but this was a state article and it should have been 2/3 about OKC and 1/3 about Tulsa since that is how the economy and population lie. Also, OKC is riding a recent wave of accolades nationally so the state should have rode that with this article and gave OKC its due; THEN said, "by the way - we have another amazing city who is also developing, here is what she has to offer that is a little different than OKC but still represents OKLAHOMA."

The whole state needs to start to recognize that OKC is not just a govt city but it is the largest city, economy, and every sector you could name just about; and the state should ride that when it's promoting itself (in urban articles, anyway). It only makes sense when you're trying to compete for economic/urban tourist dollars as was should have been the point of these two articles.

+1 x1000

I was on a United flight from London to Houston yesterday, and snapped a few picks of the dossier. I thought it was a very positive portrayal of the entire state, with some great information about Oklahoma City. The two people sitting behind me started discussing Oklahoma City, too. One person - a 28 year old guy from Houston, who works in London most of the time, was visiting with his seat mate - a 50-something year old woman who lived in Oklahoma City. I overheard them talking about Devon Tower, Bricktown, the improvements to Will Rogers, and the overall economy of the city and state. It was somewhat surreal to be sitting on a tarmac at Heathrow, overhearing a conversation about Oklahoma. I loved it.

Here's some of the dossier:
9278

9279

9280

no, because they don't pay as much since OKC is larger and has a larger base. Fact is fact.


Every state has a largest city for a reason and that is for it to prosper and go against other state's (usually their largest city). Again, I'm not talking about OKC vs Tulsa competing as cities, I'm talking about OKLAHOMA promoting itself as a state. OK should lean heavily on OKC since it is rightfully so the state's shining star. It is foolish not to. And was foolish to allow a national audience to see how backwater the state is by allowing Tulsa to pre-empt OKC. This wouldn't happen in any other state that Im aware of; and this 'bush league' stuff must stop.


If OKC and Tulsa are direct competitors as cities, I could see but this was a state article and it should have been 2/3 about OKC and 1/3 about Tulsa since that is how the economy and population lie. Also, OKC is riding a recent wave of accolades nationally so the state should have rode that with this article and gave OKC its due; THEN said, "by the way - we have another amazing city who is also developing, here is what she has to offer that is a little different than OKC but still represents OKLAHOMA."

The whole state needs to start to recognize that OKC is not just a govt city but it is the largest city, economy, and every sector you could name just about; and the state should ride that when it's promoting itself (in urban articles, anyway). It only makes sense when you're trying to compete for economic/urban tourist dollars as was should have been the point of these two articles.

I agree completely. OKC is the state's largest city and shining star. When Tulsa sees an economic and population boom that eclipses what is currently happening in OKC, then they will deserve more spotlight.

I was on a United flight from London to Houston yesterday, and snapped a few picks of the dossier. I thought it was a very positive portrayal of the entire state, with some great information about Oklahoma City. The two people sitting behind me started discussing Oklahoma City, too. One person - a 28 year old guy from Houston, who works in London most of the time, was visiting with his seat mate - a 50-something year old woman who lived in Oklahoma City. I overheard them talking about Devon Tower, Bricktown, the improvements to Will Rogers, and the overall economy of the city and state. It was somewhat surreal to be sitting on a tarmac at Heathrow, overhearing a conversation about Oklahoma. I loved it.



Now see what I mean about the positive impact of the state with OKC rightfully carrying the torch. ...

This is from Travel and Leisure magazine's November issue showing the results of their "America's Favorite Cities" survey.

America?s Favorite Cities 2014 - Articles | Travel + Leisure (http://www.travelandleisure.com/articles/americas-favorite-cities-2014)

They had 50,000 people who voted so it should be a fairly accurate account of how people feel.

OKC was ranked 2nd in affordability and 5th in friendliness. Hopefully we can start working our way up in some of the other categories too.

Oklahoma City named third-worst city for fall allergies | Oklahoma City - OKC - KOCO.com (http://www.koco.com/news/oklahoma-city-named-thirdworst-city-for-fall-allergies/29441632)

Oklahoma City named third-worst city for fall allergies | Oklahoma City - OKC - KOCO.com (http://www.koco.com/news/oklahoma-city-named-thirdworst-city-for-fall-allergies/29441632)

Agree

I would agree as well. My allergies have been in high gear for weeks!

Best Trips 2015 -- National Geographic Traveler (http://travel.nationalgeographic.com/travel/best-trips-2015/#/canal-bricktown-oklahoma-city_85215_600x450.jpg)
probably posted already, but thought that was pretty neat.

https://sp.yimg.com/ib/th?id=HN.608023492376399821&pid=15.1&P=0


Oklahoma City Barons
Oklahoma City Blue
Oklahoma City Energy FC
Oklahoma City RedHawks
Oklahoma City Thunder

Thank you for all the things you do in your Oklahoma City Community.

The fact that we've made it into the National Geographic's list of places to visit is saying something. People from all over the world read these articles.

A foodie friend sent me this. A couple of months old, but a good read:

A Chef's Tour of Oklahoma City - Hungry Crowd | Food & Wine (http://www.foodandwine.com/blogs/2014/9/2/why-one-of-americas-best-chefs-takes-his-inspirations-from-oklahoma-city)

Eighth best city for young entrepreneurs.

Best Cities for Young Entrepreneurs (http://www.nerdwallet.com/blog/cities/economics/best-cities-for-young-entrepreneurs/)

Looks like we're continuing our rounds in the airline magazines. Made Southwest's magazine for December

Southwest: The Magazine / Your Adventure in Oklahoma City (http://www.southwestthemagazine.com/your_adventure_in/article/your_adventure_in_oklahoma_city1/)http://www.okctalk.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=9595&stc=1

Southwest: The Magazine / Your Adventure in Oklahoma City

I am not sure where they found it, but I laughed when I saw the lead image on the website, it is the photoshop they made of what a zip like crossing might look like. However the line they photoshoped in ended up be several hundred feed away from the towers (one of which you can see is connected to nothing in the background), if I remember right the person is/was one of the OKC staff on the kiddie zip line that is like 10 feet off the ground and 30 feet long near the base of the main zipline tower from an earlier promo photo of the Blue Cross/Shield playground opening.

http://d3sjfaqozbszm1.cloudfront.net/uploads/images/AI-Oklahoma-fresh-air.jpg

I am not sure where they found it, but I laughed when I saw the lead image on the website, it is the photoshop they made of what a zip like crossing might look like. However the line they photoshoped in ended up be several hundred feed away from the towers (one of which you can see is connected to nothing in the background), if I remember right the person is/was one of the OKC staff on the kiddie zip line that is like 10 feet off the ground and 30 feet long near the base of the main zipline tower from an earlier promo photo of the Blue Cross/Shield playground opening.

http://d3sjfaqozbszm1.cloudfront.net/uploads/images/AI-Oklahoma-fresh-air.jpg

Didn't notice this at first...that's hilarious.

Ouch.

America?s Most and Least Attractive People- Page 14 - Articles | Travel + Leisure (http://www.travelandleisure.com/articles/americas-most-and-least-attractive-people/14)

Ouch.

America?s Most and Least Attractive People- Page 14 - Articles | Travel + Leisure (http://www.travelandleisure.com/articles/americas-most-and-least-attractive-people/14)

Locals did get credit for being friendly and for being excellent drivers.

wat

Ouch.

America?s Most and Least Attractive People- Page 14 - Articles | Travel + Leisure (http://www.travelandleisure.com/articles/americas-most-and-least-attractive-people/14)

Ya know, I LOVE OKC and will defend it to the ends of the earth, but I gotta say it is not a fashionable place. Don't get me wrong, I embraced OKC's casual style when I was there; I had lots of flip flops, OU/Thunder T shirts aplenty, and at least 2 pair of cowboy boots. Now that I am in Dallas which is pretty much LA-lite it's dawned on me how frumpy I am.

But I completely disagree with Miami and Charleston SC being 1 and 3 most fashionable. When I was in Miami, it was full of muscle shirt wearing, gel-hair douches and girls (they call themselves chongas) who thought they were hot, complete with ill fitting clothes in an odd attempt to show off their boobs and ass. Charleston was one of my favorite cities to visit, but going there it felt like I was back at an OU fraternity party. Lots of middle aged men dressed like frat stars and the women were attractive but non-descript SEC Sorority clones. Some may like that look but it's not for me.

So if this is the standard we are supposed to be at, then don't change, OKC. Keep wearing that stained Thunder shirt and flip flops with pride!

Locals did get credit for being friendly and for being excellent drivers.

wat

Yeah, I don't know... Friendly yes. Good drivers? Nasomuch. (And how does that relate to being good looking, anyway?)

Yeah, I don't know... Friendly yes. Good drivers? Nasomuch. (And how does that relate to being good looking, anyway?)

I've never understood the friendly part either, honestly. But I really disagree with the good driver bit. OKC is probably the worst collection of drivers I've ever experienced myself. I moved back here from Oregon in 2007; about two weeks later, I was in an auto accident when an uninsured driver blazed through a red light. About three years after that, I was in another auto accident when a yuppie in a giant SUV blazed through a red light (that one was devastating).

Also, no idea how it relates to being good looking. I guess it's the equivalent of "I should introduce you to my friend. She's fat and her teeth are f*cked up, but she's so sweet and outgoing!"

The only thing objective in that list is the fact that OKC is underserved in retail. If you gauge cities by dress to determine attractiveness, San Diego would not be that high. It is the land of tee shirts, shorts, and flipflops, every day of the year. Heck, I am an attorney and wear shorts to work most days, but I do put wear boat shoes instead of flipflops.

The only thing objective in that list is the fact that OKC is underserved in retail. If you gauge cities by dress to determine attractiveness, San Diego would not be that high. It is the land of tee shirts, shorts, and flipflops, every day of the year. Heck, I am an attorney and wear shorts to work most days, but I do put wear boat shoes instead of flipflops.

I think high-end retail per capita was a huge factor in this list. Charleston SC has a lot for a city it's size. They have a few stores even Charlotte doesn't have. OKC on the other hand pulls way below its weight in this area. By no means am I saying everyone should spend a lot on clothes, but a metro area of 1.3 million people should have a lot more higher end retail options than OKC does (in all sectors, not just clothing).

Really 90% of the shops and restaurants are the same in OKC as in Dallas or San Diego. However, OKC lacks that top 10% of stores and destination venues. One really nice destination shopping center with a Nordys and H&M and Traders and a few other select stores, like Restoration Hardware and Crate and Barrel, would be all it takes. Add a Costco somewhere, and you would have it all. It's all coming pretty soon, I bet, if you have a developer willing to build a really great looking shopping venue that meets the expectations of those retailers. Belle Isle could certainly have been that place. Hopefully Chisholm Trails will be if they do it right.

Really 90% of the shops and restaurants are the same in OKC as in Dallas or San Diego. However, OKC lacks that top 10% of stores and destination venues. One really nice destination shopping center with a Nordys and H&M and Traders and a few other select stores, like Restoration Hardware and Crate and Barrel, would be all it takes. Add a Costco somewhere, and you would have it all. It's all coming pretty soon, I bet, if you have a developer willing to build a really great looking shopping venue that meets the expectations of those retailers. Belle Isle could certainly have been that place. Hopefully Chisholm Trails will be if they do it right.

I think The Trianlge might be that area. There is a lot of land between Whole Foods/Anthro/West Elm and 63rd street. The question is: will Glimcher build it? They are in a holding pattern now, but if everything keeps filling up in CC, it might be in their best interest to build new to suit. I don't see a Costco going in there, H&M is already rumored to be at QSM (although, I don't consider that upscale) and TJ's at The Triangle, but the others could fill that void and the income in that area is enough to perk up the ears and pockets of retails stores, one would think.

Costco needs to be in a big box area, not a nice shopping center.

Putting aside the ocean, mountains, and weather, what San Diego has that OKC doesn't (but could have), is not the stores, per se, but shopping centers that are nicely designed and inviting. We have lots of little shopping centers and districts with central courtyards filled with tables and outdoor furniture, firepits, and typically a fountain that little kids can run through and play in. There is usually a coffee shop nearby and people sitting around having coffee and lots of dogs on leashes. These little urban centers don't have any better stores than in OKC, but they do have atmosphere and are stylish and architecturally interesting.

Costco needs to be in a big box area, not a nice shopping center.

Putting aside the ocean, mountains, and weather, what San Diego has that OKC doesn't (but could have), is not the stores, per se, but shopping centers that are nicely designed and inviting. We have lots of little shopping centers and districts with central courtyards filled with tables and outdoor furniture, firepits, and typically a fountain that little kids can run through and play in. There is usually a coffee shop nearby and people sitting around having coffee and lots of dogs on leashes. These little urban centers don't have any better stores than in OKC, but they do have atmosphere and are stylish and architecturally interesting.

This sounds like the typical Charlotte shopping center. What OKC needs is something that is a combination of that and Utica Square. Utica is above anything that OKC has but it doesn't quite have that inviting design that you speak of. There have been developments like that proposed in OKC before but for whatever reason they were cancelled or down scaled. Hopefully Chisholm Creek actually makes it happen.

Retail is one part of it, but it's really just residuals of OKC's blue collar culture. It's just not a thing to dress nice here yet. It's slowly shifting as we get more white-collar jobs and national employers, but It's still totally acceptable to show up to a swanky restaurant for a special occasion wearing a pair of levi's and a "nice" t-shirt.

No lie, I remember seeing a guy (probably mid 50's) COURTSIDE at a Thunder playoff game (right next to the bench so he got plenty of air-time) wearing an OU polo, kakhi shorts, and flip flops with socks. That sadly is the perfect picture of Oklahoma's "1%".

OKC's retail isn't horrific, it's just bleh. One or two stores usually dominate a particular style or price point, so no one is really competing for your business. Lack of competition makes OKC's retail landscape pretty lukewarm, which hurts when one of the nation's top shopping cities is 3 hours away.

OKC's retail scene is pretty bad for a metro area this size. If this were Wichita it would be more acceptable. I have been trying to be as positive as I can but I have to call this how I see it. You are right in that lack of competition really hurts the retail scene at all levels. I think that is starting to change as OKC is slowly making its way onto the radar of national retailers, but this city was completely ignored for so long it's going to take time to catch up.

Anecdotal evidence:

My Mom lived in Edmond for about 10 years after living in the Dallas area for most of her adult life. After she had been in Edmond for about a year, a longtime friend of hers from Dallas stayed for a weekend. After seeing what my Mom would leave the house in (things like...jeans...) the friend was worried that my Mom had "let herself go" by not putting on full makeup to go to the grocery store.

OKC is a lot of things. It is not stylish, and I"m okay with that,

Costco needs to be in a big box area, not a nice shopping center.

Putting aside the ocean, mountains, and weather, what San Diego has that OKC doesn't (but could have), is not the stores, per se, but shopping centers that are nicely designed and inviting. We have lots of little shopping centers and districts with central courtyards filled with tables and outdoor furniture, firepits, and typically a fountain that little kids can run through and play in. There is usually a coffee shop nearby and people sitting around having coffee and lots of dogs on leashes. These little urban centers don't have any better stores than in OKC, but they do have atmosphere and are stylish and architecturally interesting.
This. If you were to go back and read my old posts, you'd see that I've long been a crtic of how shopping centers are designed (or their lack thereof) in the greater OKC metro. For the most part, shopping centers in this area are just a string of store fronts directly facing the road. No courtyards. No people places for folks to gather, have coffe or hang. No amenities etc.



No lie, I remember seeing a guy (probably mid 50's) COURTSIDE at a Thunder playoff game (right next to the bench so he got plenty of air-time) wearing an OU polo, kakhi shorts, and flip flops with socks. That sadly is the perfect picture of Oklahoma's "1%".
Dean Blevins

Anecdotal evidence:

My Mom lived in Edmond for about 10 years after living in the Dallas area for most of her adult life. After she had been in Edmond for about a year, a longtime friend of hers from Dallas stayed for a weekend. After seeing what my Mom would leave the house in (things like...jeans...) the friend was worried that my Mom had "let herself go" by not putting on full makeup to go to the grocery store.

OKC is a lot of things. It is not stylish, and I"m okay with that,

Mr. Cotter, here's more Anecdotal evidence:

That's typical of Dallas women; they like to dress up, put on that wig, high heels and go shopping. My sister (Emma) was a lifelong Dallas resident, she worked for some of the riches women in the Dallas area. I remember one of her employers giving her a Lincoln Towncar because she wanted her maid to ride around in style. Emma had Victorian style furniture in her home (passed down) that rivaled that of the rich in famous. Some of the furniture looked as though it had never been sat on or used. Her employers would always redecorate every 3-5 years; Emma was always asked if she wanted what was being discarded.

My sister, Emma was a damn good cook. I wish I had gotten some of her recipes before she passed away. People just bragged about her cooking, baking (buttered yeast rolls) and meal preparation skills. I will never forget the breakfast sausage she would cook; those things sat out until they grew harry molds (cultured sausage she called them), her biscuits, rich eggs (had the rooster with them), sausage and gravy was the talk-of-the-town. She was compared to the best.

We use to love our trips to Dallas; Emma loved the Big 'D' and she was quick to let you know that everything was 'big' in Texas and she also liked little ole Oklahome' as well :whisper: , everything was 'great big this and great big that' in Dallas. As her baby brothers, we couldn't help but smile, Emma loved Dallas, the Dallas Farmer's Market area was one of her favorites. 'Oklahome' has a smaller version of the Dallas market; however, for some reason the vegetables were not as good as the 'great big squash, garlic, tomatoes, onions, okra and the like they grew in Texas. Much to our dislike, she was right (correct); they grew huge vegetables in that black dirt in Texas. She couldn't figure out how we grew anything in this Oklahome' red clay.

Never forgot how clean a housekeeper Emma was; my oldest brother once made a joking comment that your draws (underwear) couldn't hit the bathroom floor; Emma was there to pick them up and put them in the washer.

I truly miss Emma & her husband Jim, who my oldest brother always described him as telling his wild 'Canterbury Tales.' Jim told some doozies...

Yes, Mr. Cotter, I got educated on DALLAS 24-7. We had nothing like Cartier's (precious fine jewelry) in Dallas. She burst out with laughter when she visited Zale's in downtown Oklahoma City--compared it to a 'thrift or rummage sale store.'

So, one more thread gets diverted into how low class OKC is.

I love how so many feed off stereotypes. LOL.

Laramie, you do know Zales is a Dallas operation, right?. And it isn't near OKC's finest jeweler. It is a mass merchandiser of jewelry.

We used to go to Oakbrook Center when we lived in IL, pretty decent shopping center, interesting mix going all the way from Nordstrom to Auntie Anne's, would be nice to have one similar here...

Not sure if it's one of America's Premier Shopping Places, but this has a nice list of retailers and pics.

Oakbrook Center | America's Premier Shopping Places (http://www.americaspremiershoppingplaces.com/apsp/locations/profiles/oakbrook-center.html)

To clarify, I don't want us to compare with Dallas. That is a special level of snobbiness and uber materialism that is almost unmatched, and their growth has been very forced and inorganic. I'm just saying it might be nice for us to upgrade from 'socks with sandals'.

But yes, back on topic.

It wasn't Dean Blevins, so that means there's at least 2 of those guys.

To clarify, I don't want us to compare with Dallas. That is a special level of snobbiness and uber materialism that is almost unmatched, and their growth has been very forced and inorganic. I'm just saying it might be nice for us to upgrade from 'socks with sandals'.

But yes, back on topic.I love it. Talk sh!t on a city that better than yours. OK. OKC will never become half of what is Dallas is, which is a world class, cosmopolitan city that is known world wide. When I talk about me living in Dallas, people say what a nice place. When I say I live in OKC, people say wow. Not in a good way. Houston is sprawled mess and Dallas is a cookie cutter, snobby city. Good work.

Every city has a distinct personality. OKC will never be the fashion-conscious city Dallas is and that's OK. That just isn't this city's personality. That doesn't mean it shouldn't have higher-end retail options for those who want them. Major cities are diverse and they have options.

I love it. Talk sh!t on a city that better than yours. OK. OKC will never become half of what is Dallas is, which is a world class, cosmopolitan city that is known world wide. When I talk about me living in Dallas, people say what a nice place. When I say I live in OKC, people say wow. Not in a good way. Houston is sprawled mess and Dallas is a cookie cutter, snobby city. Good work.

I'm not really the biggest fan of Oklahoma City for various reasons, but even I find your passive aggressiveness a little funny. In the time I spent in Dallas as a kid (varying months between 1999-2007) staying with my dad, I don't see what was said in Mike_M's comment that was so inaccurately portrayed that offended you so much.

Dallas cosmopolitan....lol. sorry PluPan...

I love it. Talk sh!t on a city that better than yours. OK. OKC will never become half of what is Dallas is, which is a world class, cosmopolitan city that is known world wide. When I talk about me living in Dallas, people say what a nice place. When I say I live in OKC, people say wow. Not in a good way. Houston is sprawled mess and Dallas is a cookie cutter, snobby city. Good work.

This comment lol. I am in no way surprised that you like Dallas.

this comment lol. I am in no way surprised that you like dallas.
ok.

Anecdotal evidence:

My Mom lived in Edmond for about 10 years after living in the Dallas area for most of her adult life. After she had been in Edmond for about a year, a longtime friend of hers from Dallas stayed for a weekend. After seeing what my Mom would leave the house in (things like...jeans...) the friend was worried that my Mom had "let herself go" by not putting on full makeup to go to the grocery store.

OKC is a lot of things. It is not stylish, and I"m okay with that,

Here's a story for you.

This past September I attended my company anniversary party at the George Bush Center in Dallas. These things, at least at my old job, tend to request dressy/casual cocktail party-type attire. So I went with a nice plaid shirt, sport coat, nice, loose khakis, and some loafers. It was literally the same outfit I would wear at my old employer's party when I was in OKC.

Upon arriving at the center, I was immediately mortified when I noticed how wildly underdressed I was. Nearly everyone was in some sort of tailored black suit, expensive dress shoes, etc. Now truthfully, I doubt most people gave a second glance in how I was dressed. But I caught at least 3 or 4 of the ugliest "WTF sneers" from people towards me, all from other guys FWIW. It felt very judgemental and at first generated some panic. But then I was just like "F*** what these people think of me," proceeded to down about 3 jack and cokes in 15 minutes, and had a great time. I even had at least 2 people compliment me on how "comfortable" I looked, whatever that means but I'll take it as a compliment.

So yes, Dallas can be a very dressy and somewhat materialistic place, although there is nothing wrong with wanting to look good. And most big cities are; I was in NYC this June and it felt like half of Manhattan fell out of an American Apparel catalog. I definitely have to be a lot more aware of my clothing choices here than I ever did in OKC. Ironically, I ended up coming up to Norman for the OU/Tennessee game the next day after this anniversary party, and it took me a while to adjust how casual everyone was dressed. But it's not something to be ashamed of. I probably did not truly appreciate how laid back and casual OKC can be until I was in another enviornment.

OK, now back to your regualrly scheduled pissing contest :-)

To clarify, I don't want us to compare with Dallas. That is a special level of snobbiness and uber materialism that is almost unmatched, and their growth has been very forced and inorganic. I'm just saying it might be nice for us to upgrade from 'socks with sandals'.

But yes, back on topic.

Let's be real here, up until quite recently, there was nothing organic about OKC's strides forward.

By the way, it also depends where you are in Dallas. There are plenty of areas in Dallas that feel just like OKC, but obviously, if you get into some of trendier areas closer to downtown you'll notice a difference. But that goes for most cities, including OKC, but just maybe to a lesser degree.