I don't know enough about Wheeler's proposal to comment on it besides saying that dual language immersion schools are in my opinion the best school model there is. My only question has been, why can't new Wheeler residents just get involved in the existing local school and work with local families already attending the school to advocate for a dual language immersion school? It always rubs me the wrong way to see people with means move into an area and decide that their children should get the school of their choosing.

Yeah, how dare people consider the essence of educational freedom or contemplate the best possible choices for their own children. They should be bowing and scraping to the state! #smh

Disregard.

But not by creating a brand new school whenever you want.

Why?

Why?

Can't afford the ones we have.

Why?

They can totally make their own school. Build a private school, thats why they exist. Dont suck off and rely on taxpayer dollars for this. If you dont want to put in the money to start you're own private school, get involved and help lift up the local schools already in the area to bring them to your standards. I would put good money on most in the community (not all) being on board with advancing the quality of education in existing schools.

^^^^ why shouldn’t they? If you have the money and means you should be able to send your kid where you choose. What is the problem?

Then they can send them to private school, cant they? Or they could have chosen to live somewhere else, if they are paying over $200/ft for a new house, Im sure they have several housing and school options.

Mount St. Mary's and Sacred Heart are very nearby and are excellent private schools.

Did I read the article correctly? They want to make sure the area stays at 60+ free and reduced lunches? Why is that the goal or a deciding factor? Can someone please help me out with that statement in the article?

Can someone explain to me how this denial is good for the low income families in the area around Wheeler that would have been able to send their kids to this school? I suspect this pretty much guarantees that people living in Wheeler will send their kids to private school, and the existing public schools in the area will continue on in their current state.

The existing public schools will not have dollars siphoned off to a charter school that those in the surrounding area have no guarantee of being admitted. I question how many of those in the Wheeler development would be using the public school in the first place.

^^probably a decent number of them since it would be #1 within walking distance, #2 strength in numbers (neighbors' kids would likely also attend), and would be a charter. John Rex is successful in attracting downtown residents despite being public charter so I would assume the wheeler school would have also attracted Wheeler residents. Who knows though.. not me!

Lol.

Can someone explain to me how this denial is good for the low income families in the area around Wheeler that would have been able to send their kids to this school? I suspect this pretty much guarantees that people living in Wheeler will send their kids to private school, and the existing public schools in the area will continue on in their current state.

It's so sad that this is such a guarantee. It's a sad state of affairs to see the United States regress back to a segregated school system. White people won't even consider sending their kids to schools children of color have no choice but to attend. We live in a country where privileged kids get doors opened and kids in poverty and of color gets doors closed... starting at 5 years old.

If you're actually concerned about the resegregation of schools in the U.S. then read Hannah Nikole Jones work: https://nikolehannahjones.com/work/

The existing public schools will not have dollars siphoned off to a charter school that those in the surrounding area have no guarantee of being admitted. I question how many of those in the Wheeler development would be using the public school in the first place.

I imagine the school was at least part of the draw for the families moving down there. Unless something changes, we'll never know.

Just as we don't know how many families with children will live there, versus DINK'S

Per statute, the process is not over with the first rejection from OKCPS. The applicant has the option of submitting a revised application. If that's rejected as well, the applicant may appeal to the State Board of Education. If the State Board so chooses, it can sponsor the applicant. See E and G: http://www.oscn.net/applications/oscn/DeliverDocument.asp?CiteID=365463

It's so sad that this is such a guarantee. It's a sad state of affairs to see the United States regress back to a segregated school system. White people won't even consider sending their kids to schools children of color have no choice but to attend. We live in a country where privileged kids get doors opened and kids in poverty and of color gets doors closed... starting at 5 years old.

If you're actually concerned about the resegregation of schools in the U.S. then read Hannah Nikole Jones work: https://nikolehannahjones.com/work/

Without dragging the thread too off topic, her interview last year on Chris Hayes' podcast Why Is This Happening? was really fantastic. She speaks with such refreshing clarity on the issue.

The allegations of Epic embezzling millions will not help the cause of anyone trying to establish a new charter school in Oklahoma.

https://oklahoman.com/article/5636395/epic-embezzled-millions-with-ghost-students-osbi-says

I imagine the school was at least part of the draw for the families moving down there. Unless something changes, we'll never know.

Im sure it was. It must suck not being able to use public money (tif) to build a shiny new school that was supposed to help sell more homes that also got public money (more tif).

Im sure it was. It must suck not being able to use public money (tif) to build a shiny new school that was supposed to help sell more homes that also got public money (more tif).

Yeah, if this wasn't for TIF I would support the school. You can't make OKC public school district better until you increase property values within its borders. It's not all about race for people not wanting to live in OKC school district if they have families.

Does anyone have an unadulterated copy of this apparent master plan that the Wheeler Instagram posted a short while ago?

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheeler071819a.jpg

I’m curious as to what exactly will be developed in phase 2. It would appear the land east of the runway homes and south of the terminal building is accommodating a possible larger single structure. Maybe clearing the way for future condos/apartment/mixed-use? Also when will the Big Friendly Brewery construction begin and where?

They submitted the following master plan with their PUD rezoning application:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheeler071819b.jpg


As for the Big Friendly, they have not submitted any building permit applications, which is always the first step. After that, it usually takes several months before the permit is issued and construction begins. It will go here:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheelerbrewery2.jpg

I love old and new urbanism and my wish is that every neighborhood have a school within walking distance. More importantly, I want every child to have access to a good school which means elevating resources and curriculum across the entire district. The proposed attendance zone was 2/3 Wheeler land and 1/3 the neighborhood to the West. It is hard to justify siphoning tax dollars away from the already existing public schools to operate a public Charter school for the primary benefit of one developer and socioeconomic category. Lee Elementary is 1.7 miles away and can provide a cross-cultural experience for Wheeler residents if that is what they are looking for. This proposal does not fit with the broader initiative of equity across OKCPS. If this is approved, what would keep any one developer from plopping a charter school down in the middle of their development as another amenity of the neighborhood?

I don't understand the objections to an elementary school for Wheeler in the light of John Rex Elementary along with a planned middle and high school for downtown.

I don't understand the objections to an elementary school for Wheeler in the light of John Rex Elementary along with a planned middle and high school for downtown.

Charter schools are taboo right now, in light of the fraud that is Epic Charter Schools.

I don't understand the objections to an elementary school for Wheeler in the light of John Rex Elementary along with a planned middle and high school for downtown.

Previous posts offer many justifications. Check em out.
No sense in repeating the many reasons on "why not".

Charter schools are taboo right now, in light of the fraud that is Epic Charter Schools.

It's not just that charter schools are taboo now, but that they've become tools for those with more means, influence, or wealth to segregate their children away from children of color. For-profit charter schools are just straight trash with so much corruption and absurdness that I won't even address them.

I don't understand the objections to an elementary school for Wheeler in the light of John Rex Elementary along with a planned middle and high school for downtown.

downtown didn't already have an elementary (and middle) school, and with the huge employment and growing population, a charter school seemed like the best solution (one I agree with). Wheeler has several schools existing nearby where surely there are multiple language offerings already existing. Therefore, opening a charter school would theoretically reduce funds for existing schools so that Wheeler residents can associate with their own neighborhood in a shiny new unnecessary school.

Summary:

Rex: needed for the huge employment center that is downtown OKC (largest by far in the metro/state), didn't have an existing school in the local area/CBD, charter school was quickly established (faster than OKCPS could probably open a school themselves), growing residential population downtown expected to explode (so now need middle and high school), a one time deal for the CBD to have local schools

Wheeler: existing schools nearby - already multi-cultural/lingual, not an employment center, growing but not anywhere close to as much residential as downtown has or will have, private schools nearby, could set precedent for future residential projects

downtown didn't already have an elementary (and middle) school, and with the huge employment and growing population, a charter school seemed like the best solution (one I agree with). Wheeler has several schools existing nearby where surely there are multiple language offerings already existing. Therefore, opening a charter school would theoretically reduce funds for existing schools so that Wheeler residents can associate with their own neighborhood in a shiny new unnecessary school.

Summary:

Rex: needed for the huge employment center that is downtown OKC (largest by far in the metro/state), didn't have an existing school in the local area/CBD, charter school was quickly established (faster than OKCPS could probably open a school themselves), growing residential population downtown expected to explode (so now need middle and high school), a one time deal for the CBD to have local schools

Wheeler: existing schools nearby - already multi-cultural/lingual, not an employment center, growing but not anywhere close to as much residential as downtown has or will have, private schools nearby, could set precedent for future residential projects

So its ok to create a elite school system within OKC PS as long it is downtown. Downtown already had nearby elementary schools and I believe Taft would be the middle school. Most of the southside schools are overcrowded and if Wheeler grows as expected another elementary school will be required. Not to mention the planning and building for a new school will take some time.

I love old and new urbanism and my wish is that every neighborhood have a school within walking distance. More importantly, I want every child to have access to a good school which means elevating resources and curriculum across the entire district. The proposed attendance zone was 2/3 Wheeler land and 1/3 the neighborhood to the West. It is hard to justify siphoning tax dollars away from the already existing public schools to operate a public Charter school for the primary benefit of one developer and socioeconomic category. Lee Elementary is 1.7 miles away and can provide a cross-cultural experience for Wheeler residents if that is what they are looking for. This proposal does not fit with the broader initiative of equity across OKCPS. If this is approved, what would keep any one developer from plopping a charter school down in the middle of their development as another amenity of the neighborhood?

So 2/3 would be coming from Wheeler and 1/3 coming from existing neighborhood to the west. So where does Wheeler District come up with the idea that 60% of school kids would qualify for reduced price or free lunch? Surely no one moving into wheeler will qualify income-wise for free lunches? Something doesnt add up from Wheeler representatives.

On another note, how do you predict the make up of a charter school before its even built? Are charters based on geographics or ablity? Or both? Or just who looks clean, nice and safe?

It's not just that charter schools are taboo now, but that they've become tools for those with more means, influence, or wealth to segregate their children away from children of color. For-profit charter schools are just straight trash with so much corruption and absurdness that I won't even address them.

That’s an interesting take... Racist white people just seem to be popping up everywhere these days. How do you propose we stop them?

It's not just that charter schools are taboo now, but that they've become tools for those with more means, influence, or wealth to segregate their children away from children of color. For-profit charter schools are just straight trash with so much corruption and absurdness that I won't even address them.

your post seems to imply that the primary motivation of these parents is to separate their children from children of color. i find that difficult to believe. i think most parents are largely motivated to seek out what they perceive to be the best education options for their child. maybe the options they choose incidentally result in an increase in racial segregation and that outcome may have an undesirable cost to society... but i don't think that the desire for segregation itself is the primary driver.

your post seems to imply that the primary motivation of these parents is to separate their children from children of color. i find that difficult to believe. i think most parents are largely motivated to seek out what they perceive to be the best education options for their child. maybe the options they choose incidentally result in an increase in racial segregation and that outcome may have an undesirable cost to society... but i don't think that the desire for segregation itself is the primary driver.

I think for many parents you're probably correct. They do not say, "I want segregation." And, yes, the ways schools are ranked A-F will rank high quality schools with students from low socioeconomic groups low so parents assume they're bad. I've posted this before, but listen to how Ben Felder explained how he only knew a C school was a good school because he's an education reporter on my podcast: https://visionsofed.com/2016/10/25/episode-29-education-reporting-with-ben-felder/
(https://visionsofed.com/2016/10/25/episode-29-education-reporting-with-ben-felder/)
I agree that there are many well meaning parents that aren't White supremacists or anything, but who also contribute to segregated schools because of the existing system. But some of these parents think things like, "We won't even consider sending our children to the school in this neighborhood with children of color. We'll create our own charter school that we control." Does it matter what they say? Actions speak louder than words and our schools are re-segregating at alarming rates.

Again, if you actually read people who research this like Nikole Hannah-Jones I think you'll be stunned at how much work is required for parents to ensure segregation. It's not a passive process.

That’s an interesting take... Racist white people just seem to be popping up everywhere these days. How do you propose we stop them?

Actually, nothing has really changed. White parents have always sought segregation, but the government actually required schools to integrate for about 20 years (the most successful reform in educational history) before quitting in the early 1990s, which has resulted in massive resegregation. How do we stop resegregation? It's simple. We re-implement the integration requirements of the 1970s and 1980s.

And to this larger point of who is racist and who is not, that's a whole different discussion and many people are far too fragile to admit that they may be part of and contribute to an unjust system. What I care about is that students of color increasingly attend what are termed apartheid schools (90% students of color) which often have less resources and support, high teacher turnover, and a variety of other disadvantages that should not exist in a society where meritocracy is supposedly a core value. I honestly believe that every child should have equal educational opportunity and that is a highly radical position in a society where parents with means get what they want for their children at the expense of those with less influence.

Totally agree with what Dan's saying, I grew up in OKC during busing and I learned sooooooooooo much and believe I'm a better person because of school desegregation. Had busing start when I was in elementary, still walked to my elementary school at NW 65th/Independence (from NW 67th/Miller-ish) , but was bused to Longfellow for 5th grade, then to Hoover for middle school, then to Northeast for high school.

Here's a really good article about Louisville's efforts to stay desegregated, hope they can keep it going, sounds like a hard battle...

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/kamala-harris-joe-biden-busing-louisville_n_5d2ceff0e4b0bca60364197f

Two points of context here for people that don't know who I am. First, I am a career educator who taught in public schools for six years in OKC (MPS) and I'm now an education professor. I do not consider myself an expert on school integration/segregation, but I have been teaching about it and studying it for a decade. I don't have all the answers and these problems are nuanced. And I admittedly get angry to see the second-rate education in our country not just for students of color, but other groups too (e.g., some rural schools, students with exceptionalities...). Second, I can also attest to the benefits of integrated schools, which have been proven to do absolutely no harm to the education of privileged children. I spent half of my school career in highly integrated Tulsa Public Schools and half in highly segregated private schools. I self-transferred from Cascia Hall (almost exclusively White and wealthy) to Tulsa Memorial. While each school had its benefits, I honestly believe attending Memorial changed my life trajectory for the better. Being close to students from different socioeconomic and racial groups opens your eyes to issues beyond your bubble. That's just my take, but I do apologize if anyone feels like I'm being dismissive of the challenges of finding schools for your children. The system is set up to lead you into segregated because you're constantly told which schools are "good schools" and a lot of it reinforces the unjust system.

I don't think it's that difficult of a concept dude. We talk about wanting a denser urban core. More walkability. Making public transit more viable. Here we have a development that is trying to do that. Many young families have to make the tough decision to move from the core to the suburbs for both the financial and perceived (whether right or wrong) educational benefits of the suburban schools. You can stand on your high horse all day and cite some studies, which are probably correct, but I don't see them providing any solutions that don't involve some imagined utopia in which families selflessly go against the grain and offer their own kids up as the first guinea pigs in some self-righteous attempt at trying not to appear classist/racist. In the mean time, nothing changes and we get the worst of both worlds.

This could be a school that brings young families of means into the core who might have instead padded Edmond or Norman's tax coffers. It offers Spanish immersion, unique in that I think its only offered at one other elementary in the city (unless some of the posters here are trying to subtly imply that going to a school with a large amount of english-as-a-second-language students is basically Spanish immersion). We need creative concepts like this charter school in order to combat sprawl and increase the benefits in pubic health and sustainability that come with density. And to appease you, I would argue that these kids will be more likely to interact with other kids of diverse racial and economic backgrounds here in the city core as opposed to the insular suburbs. Plus the school's boundaries include the adjacent neighborhood and it could be even further expanded with time.

Lastly, while granted I'm not too familiar with the OKC public school system, I'm under the impression that even outside of John Rex there are other charter or magnet schools that are not so hidden outlets for those of means to give their kids quality educations within the OKC public school system. Tulsa, which I'm more familiar with, has this with Booker T Washington. Local kids feed into the school but it's also a magnet school for smart kids from outside the district. It provides a "rising tides lifts all boats" effect. Through that and other ways, Tulsa has a strong upper-middle class participation in the central public schools, plus a strong civically and financially active midtown I would argue is partially a result of that. OKC is similar to a lesser degree with Classen School of Advanced Studies I believe. I just think we need actual solutions instead of snarkily chalking up it all up racism when in actuality it's a complex decision families make with both conscious and unconscious reasonings behind them.

There are other school districts in the metro area, that are more diverse compared to Edmond or Deercreek that dont get the kind of bad rap that okc does.

I can only speak to a generation ago. In the early 1990s we sent our sons to Wilson Elementary. At 21st & N. Walker, it was (is) a diverse student body that had some benefit from ancient alumni who attended when it was the good school for the Heritage Hills kids before WW2. It was an urban school in the 1990s. Had poor students and middle class, plus some rich liberals from Heritage Hills.

What I learned is that kids are kids until they reach puberty. The teachers and administration were nice and did well. It was a good experience for my sons, and they claim it was a benefit in life.

ASTEC came along right about the time they were ready for middle school and they went there a few years.

I don't think it's that difficult of a concept dude. We talk about wanting a denser urban core. More walkability. Making public transit more viable. Here we have a development that is trying to do that. Many young families have to make the tough decision to move from the core to the suburbs for both the financial and perceived (whether right or wrong) educational benefits of the suburban schools. You can stand on your high horse all day and cite some studies, which are probably correct, but I don't see them providing any solutions that don't involve some imagined utopia in which families selflessly go against the grain and offer their own kids up as the first guinea pigs in some self-righteous attempt at trying not to appear classist/racist. In the mean time, nothing changes and we get the worst of both worlds.

This could be a school that brings young families of means into the core who might have instead padded Edmond or Norman's tax coffers. It offers Spanish immersion, unique in that I think its only offered at one other elementary in the city (unless some of the posters here are trying to subtly imply that going to a school with a large amount of english-as-a-second-language students is basically Spanish immersion). We need creative concepts like this charter school in order to combat sprawl and increase the benefits in pubic health and sustainability that come with density. And to appease you, I would argue that these kids will be more likely to interact with other kids of diverse racial and economic backgrounds here in the city core as opposed to the insular suburbs. Plus the school's boundaries include the adjacent neighborhood and it could be even further expanded with time.

Lastly, while granted I'm not too familiar with the OKC public school system, I'm under the impression that even outside of John Rex there are other charter or magnet schools that are not so hidden outlets for those of means to give their kids quality educations within the OKC public school system. Tulsa, which I'm more familiar with, has this with Booker T Washington. Local kids feed into the school but it's also a magnet school for smart kids from outside the district. It provides a "rising tides lifts all boats" effect. Through that and other ways, Tulsa has a strong upper-middle class participation in the central public schools, plus a strong civically and financially active midtown I would argue is partially a result of that. OKC is similar to a lesser degree with Classen School of Advanced Studies I believe. I just think we need actual solutions instead of snarkily chalking up it all up racism when in actuality it's a complex decision families make with both conscious and unconscious reasonings behind them.

Yeah, you're not familiar with OKC. Classen SAS, Harding Prepatory, Harding Fine Arts, and Southeast are all magnet schools, I believe, and perfom significantly above the rest of the OKCPS and compete with the top in the state. Classen and Southeast are both being expanded to two-campus systems due to their success. Then you have Dove, Aztec, and Rex which are all charters, which do great as well. There are plenty of great private schools as well.

And because of these existing, and most of them underappreciated, assets... my opinion is a firm NO to the Wheeler District charter school. Want a private school? Mt. Saint Mary's. Middle School? Rex is opening one soon and Parmelee is being converted to Southeast MS. High schools? MSM, Classen SAS, Southeast. Or Rex in the future. Private, Charter, and Magnet are all accessible and nearby.

We don't need any more charters and we should support exisiting schools and help make them great too.

I think a key difference between John Rex and Wheeler is the granular ownership of property downtown and the many, many stakeholders that already exist there. Their attendance boundaries do stretch into many socioeconomic categories. Although I don't necessarily see the need for John Rex to be a charter just because it was the new school downtown.

For Wheeler, why not allow the increase in property taxes to flow to the district level and let the school district decide if and where a new school should be built. Overcrowding certainly exists in that part of town. Wheeler could even donate the land and help raise money to ensure it is located within their development. The district would certainly draw much more inclusive attendance lines and it would align with the curriculum and resources of all the other schools. Why must we assume that hip, "urban" families will only move to the urban core if there is a shiny, new charter school waiting for them? If you really want urban, go to an urban public school. Public schools in urban areas have natural diversity without the need for a diversity quotient.

So its ok to create a elite school system within OKC PS as long it is downtown. Downtown already had nearby elementary schools and I believe Taft would be the middle school. Most of the southside schools are overcrowded and if Wheeler grows as expected another elementary school will be required. Not to mention the planning and building for a new school will take some time.

there weren't any schools IN downtown, so Charter was the quickest and best quality way to do it at the time. OKCPS is in a much better position, and there are no more "empty pockets" left in OKC to justify a brand new, exclusive public school (downtown was the only spot since it had long just been conceived as a business/entertainment area).

there weren't any schools IN downtown, so Charter was the quickest and best quality way to do it at the time. OKCPS is in a much better position, and there are no more "empty pockets" left in OKC to justify a brand new, exclusive public school (downtown was the only spot since it had long just been conceived as a business/entertainment area).

Why is it quicker to start a charter school than a typical public school?

If the new schools in the Wheeler District are going to make that area an amazing place to go, why don't we just embrace it? If we depend on the system that they have in place, it will do much less good and it will be an inferior plan. Instead of making jabs at the Wheeler District, let's take a much bigger look on the system.

The Wheeler District is an amazing win for OKC! Let's remember that that this was the craziest idea years ago. It's working. Hooray!

less bureaucracy and at the time with Rex, OKCPS was in a bit of shambles that they couldn't focus on the downtown school.

I think a key difference between John Rex and Wheeler is the granular ownership of property downtown and the many, many stakeholders that already exist there. Their attendance boundaries do stretch into many socioeconomic categories. Although I don't necessarily see the need for John Rex to be a charter just because it was the new school downtown.

For Wheeler, why not allow the increase in property taxes to flow to the district level and let the school district decide if and where a new school should be built. Overcrowding certainly exists in that part of town. Wheeler could even donate the land and help raise money to ensure it is located within their development. The district would certainly draw much more inclusive attendance lines and it would align with the curriculum and resources of all the other schools. Why must we assume that hip, "urban" families will only move to the urban core if there is a shiny, new charter school waiting for them? If you really want urban, go to an urban public school. Public schools in urban areas have natural diversity without the need for a diversity quotient.

Because crappy public schools are literally one of the main reasons families move to the suburbs and don’t stay around downtown when they start having kids. It isn’t an assumption, it’s reality.

Because crappy public schools are literally one of the main reasons families move to the suburbs and don’t stay around downtown when they start having kids. It isn’t an assumption, it’s reality.

That shiny, new EPIC school has done wonders for this state's educational reputation...invest in the schools currently there, don't build new for new's sake.

Because crappy public schools are literally one of the main reasons families move to the suburbs and don’t stay around downtown when they start having kids. It isn’t an assumption, it’s reality.

Delete

If the new schools in the Wheeler District are going to make that area an amazing place to go, why don't we just embrace it? If we depend on the system that they have in place, it will do much less good and it will be an inferior plan. Instead of making jabs at the Wheeler District, let's take a much bigger look on the system.

The Wheeler District is an amazing win for OKC! Let's remember that that this was the craziest idea years ago. It's working. Hooray!

This is an interesting. Dan if desegregation is a desired outcome then why does it matter which tool you use to achieve the goal?

Are you saying you think it would be easier and cheap to accomplish desegregation using your busing method? Do you think busing would have the desired affect or do you think the people you wish to integrate will just leave because of racism or other considerations.

It seems to me that the wheeler school idea is an attempt to integrate with the existing communities south of the river. In conclusion I believe you are making an economic argument and not a desegregation argument is that correct?

Because crappy public schools are literally one of the main reasons families move to the suburbs and don’t stay around downtown when they start having kids. It isn’t an assumption, it’s reality.

What exactly makes a school crappy? Without touring the building and meeting the students, teachers, and administrators in person how do you know? On what basis do we measure the quality of a school? OKCPS is taking bold steps to ensure that every school has equitable resources, staff, and curriculum. This process will take time, but so will the development of Wheeler.

What exactly makes a school crappy?

Test scores?

Test scores?

Which test scores? Present achievement or growth over time? What if English is their second language? Haven't we learned that teaching to the test is not what we are looking for in education? Test scores are excellent predictors of a students' household income and parental education, not school quality.

Because crappy public schools are literally one of the main reasons families move to the suburbs and don’t stay around downtown when they start having kids. It isn’t an assumption, it’s reality.

First, public schools aren’t “crappy,” but thanks for your thoughtful comment and insult to those of us who worked 10-12 hour days to educate kids and improve our communities for [checks my starting teacher pay] $29,000. Second, families literally flock to suburban *public schools*. The problem is that White Flight has resulted in a segregated school system and the courts quit requiring remedies. If families with means quit leaving then the schools would all be fine.

HHE, I do not believe the Wheeler plan is about integration, but maintaining control. I appreciate they want a somewhat integrated dual immersion school (that’s a lot better than most charter plans), but they can have that without creating a new school. Why should these families get such preference and power compared to their neighbors who already live there? If there was more evidence (and maybe there is... I’d love to learn more) that the current families in the area are involved, supportive, and empowered then I’ll be convinced that integration is the aim.

Also, a good new podcast, “The Myth that Busing Failed” if you’re interested in the history and effectiveness of integration remedies: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/18/podcasts/the-daily/busing-school-segregation.html

HHE, I do not believe the Wheeler plan is about integration, but maintaining control. I appreciate they want a somewhat integrated dual immersion school (that’s a lot better than most charter plans), but they can have that without creating a new school. Why should these families get such preference and power compared to their neighbors who already live there? If there was more evidence (and maybe there is... I’d love to learn more) that the current families in the area are involved, supportive, and empowered then I’ll be convinced that integration is the aim.

yeah they should instead just trust that OKC public schools will "get it right"

I think a key difference between John Rex and Wheeler is the granular ownership of property downtown and the many, many stakeholders that already exist there. Their attendance boundaries do stretch into many socioeconomic categories. Although I don't necessarily see the need for John Rex to be a charter just because it was the new school downtown.

For Wheeler, why not allow the increase in property taxes to flow to the district level and let the school district decide if and where a new school should be built. Overcrowding certainly exists in that part of town. Wheeler could even donate the land and help raise money to ensure it is located within their development. The district would certainly draw much more inclusive attendance lines and it would align with the curriculum and resources of all the other schools. Why must we assume that hip, "urban" families will only move to the urban core if there is a shiny, new charter school waiting for them? If you really want urban, go to an urban public school. Public schools in urban areas have natural diversity without the need for a diversity quotient.

this charter school would be far more diverse than Rex

yeah they should instead just trust that OKC public schools will "get it right"

So it is all about control then? I get it.

yeah they should instead just trust that OKC public schools will "get it right"

Or become more involved with OKC public schools and the classrooms to ensure they will "get it right". That's what we do here in my son's school district in the Pac NW. Parents and concerned helping out at the schools, what a novel idea. ...