I saw in an article or in a video where they project the Wheeler District will take 20 years to develop. Am I the only one who thinks that's a bit excessive? I can see 10, but 20 is a long time for a development of that size.

I saw in an article or in a video where they project the Wheeler District will take 20 years to develop. Am I the only one who thinks that's a bit excessive? I can see 10, but 20 is a long time for a development of that size.

If 20 yeas is when it is finished, that's fine. But if at 2025 all we have are about 30 homes and 5 businesses, then that's a disappointment.

Wheeler construction set to start in 60 days

http://newsok.com/wheeler-construction-set-to-start-in-60-days/article/5542578

We should be getting close to construction starting, right?

Seems like there's regularly an update supposedly coming...

Just across the river...

http://newsok.com/wheeler-park-area-emerges-as-top-candidate-for-soccer-stadium/article/5555631

This is ideal! Would have a beautiful backdrop of the OKC skyline! I do think it is really important that wherever the location of the stadium is that the streetcar be extended to and from downtown/bricktown.

Did this break ground yet? What's going on here?

Did this break ground yet? What's going on here?

I talked to Blair about it a few days ago and they are still moving forward, but there have been a few delays. Not sure what the delays are.

I talked to Blair about it a few days ago and they are still moving forward, but there have been a few delays. Not sure what the delays are.

Ground has been broken. Multiple excavators and dump trucks were removing debris yesterday.

13999

https://media.giphy.com/media/rl0FOxdz7CcxO/giphy.gif

From this afternoon:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheelers072117a.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheelers072117b.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheelers072117c.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheelers072117d.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheelers072117e.jpg

If any of you are in the Facebook group OKC Now and Then, I think the name is, you should read what was posted about the Wheeler District this afternoon. I suppose there are more ignorant and mildly racist people out there than I thought. They most definitely do not approve of this development. /Sigh

Whoops, double post. Nothing to see here. The Wheeler District will be awesome. That is all.

If any of you are in the Facebook group OKC Now and Then, I think the name is, you should read what was posted about the Wheeler District this afternoon. I suppose there are more ignorant and mildly racist people out there than I thought. They most definitely do not approve of this development. /Sigh

The reality is we all surround ourselves with people much like ourselves and the internet and particularly social media is shocking when you get a glimpse of how a good chunk of the populace really behaves and believes.

It's the on-line version of going to the fair... Then you go back to your little protected world and forget there are so, so many people that are different than yourself.

Thank you for the update. Are there any official plans that are more in depth than the ones previously shown earlier in this thread.

The reality is we all surround ourselves with people much like ourselves and the internet and particularly social media is shocking when you get a glimpse of how a good chunk of the populace really behaves and believes.

It's the on-line version of going to the fair... Then you go back to your little protected world and forget there are so, so many people that are different than yourself.

Classic !

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheeler073017a.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheeler073017b.jpg

Will this development have a wall around it? Or will it be open , non gated..

^^^^^^^^^
Non-gated. Physical connection to the community and walkability are its key principles. The Western frontage will include commercial/retail that serves everyone; not just residents.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheeler10017a.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheeler10017b.jpg

Are there any detailed renderings and site plans for what this area will be?

That's a big chunk of land! What percentage of the total project is that?

Anyone on here signing up for the block party?

Anyone on here signing up for the block party?

details?

Hope you are well! We wanted to personally thank you for your continued support of Wheeler, and make sure you were one of the first to get information as we release plans for Wheeler Home.

Over the past three years, we have been working to pull together all of the pieces – the plan and approvals, the architects and builders, the streets and shops – laying the foundation to deliver on the whole Wheeler experience.

Now, we are ready to take the next step! With the creation of Wheeler Home, an in-house homebuilding company led by Greg McAlister, we have an experienced team ready to deliver new Wheeler Homes with thoughtful design and beautiful craftsmanship. We have a variety of housing plans, price points, styles and amenities that will be released in the coming weeks. You can claim your spot, and be one of the first to review plans and select your home, by placing a (fully refundable) $1,000 deposit, and joining The Block Party.

What is The Block Party? The Block Party is an opportunity for Wheeler’s future neighbors to check out home plans, review pricing, meet our team, and get to know one another just a little better before deciding to help us make Wheeler Oklahoma City’s next great urban neighborhood.

By joining The Block Party you’ll receive:
An exclusive invitation to our Home Plan Release Event at the Holiday Pop-up Shops on Sunday, November 19th.
First priority in reviewing home plans and pricing, and selecting your new lot, and
The opportunity to be counted among the first urban pioneers to call Wheeler home.
And of course, if you decide it’s not the right time to make the move, then your deposit will be refunded in full.

You can claim your spot by following this link: https://www.wheelerdistrict.com/home/

Hope to see you at The Block Party and appreciate you considering calling Wheeler home!

Sincerely,

Team Wheeler

Ugh

Ugh

Ugh?

Ugh?

Acronym - Ultra great homes...

Hope you are well! We wanted to personally thank you for your continued support of Wheeler, and make sure you were one of the first to get information as we release plans for Wheeler Home.

Over the past three years, we have been working to pull together all of the pieces – the plan and approvals, the architects and builders, the streets and shops – laying the foundation to deliver on the whole Wheeler experience.

Now, we are ready to take the next step! With the creation of Wheeler Home, an in-house homebuilding company led by Greg McAlister, we have an experienced team ready to deliver new Wheeler Homes with thoughtful design and beautiful craftsmanship. We have a variety of housing plans, price points, styles and amenities that will be released in the coming weeks. You can claim your spot, and be one of the first to review plans and select your home, by placing a (fully refundable) $1,000 deposit, and joining The Block Party.

What is The Block Party? The Block Party is an opportunity for Wheeler’s future neighbors to check out home plans, review pricing, meet our team, and get to know one another just a little better before deciding to help us make Wheeler Oklahoma City’s next great urban neighborhood.

By joining The Block Party you’ll receive:
An exclusive invitation to our Home Plan Release Event at the Holiday Pop-up Shops on Sunday, November 19th.
First priority in reviewing home plans and pricing, and selecting your new lot, and
The opportunity to be counted among the first urban pioneers to call Wheeler home.
And of course, if you decide it’s not the right time to make the move, then your deposit will be refunded in full.

You can claim your spot by following this link: https://www.wheelerdistrict.com/home/

Hope to see you at The Block Party and appreciate you considering calling Wheeler home!

Sincerely,

Team Wheeler

Love the idea

acronym - ultra great homes...

winner.

McAlister does great work.. There's no way I'm moving from my current digs but I'm excited enough to at least daydream about shelling out the $1000 for this.

Ugh?

Requiring people to put down a 1K deposit really shoots the "mixed-income neighborhood" idea right in the foot. Of course, they say they want mixed income, but nothing they've shown us has indicated it will actually be that.

Requiring people to put down a 1K deposit really shoots the "mixed-income neighborhood" idea right in the foot. Of course, they say they want mixed income, but nothing they've shown us has indicated it will actually be that.

I don't think you have to have the deposit to buy here, once they start building. It seems to me they want input and by requiring a deposit they can limit the input down to people who are seriously considering it. A grand is a good deal of money, but it's really not a lot in the grand scheme of things. If I were closer to buying I'd consider it.

Yeah, you just have to put in a deposit to get early access to the plans and lot to see if you like what is happening. And then you get the opportunity to buy into the starter 250-300k homes. This is going to allow all of the upper middle class young white couples (frankly, like me) to get in before anyone else. The only houses coming after these will be 600K house and tiny homes. Which again will both probably have some early access that will limit the people who can afford the tiny homes from even getting a chance. I just think it's dumb. It makes sense though. This is really valuable land.

It's really the same approach they took for Carlton Landing, which is apparently this oasis of New Urbanism on the lake, that happens to only be accessible to rich white people.

It's really the same approach they took for Carlton Landing, which is apparently this oasis of New Urbanism on the lake, that happens to only be accessible to rich white people.

Why wouldn’t it be accessible to rich people of any other race?

Why wouldn’t it be accessible to rich people of any other race?

I'd assumed that rich black people and rich Indian people and others were allowed access. But I wouldn't know for sure since I'm poor white people.

Yeah, you just have to put in a deposit to get early access to the plans and lot to see if you like what is happening. And then you get the opportunity to buy into the starter 250-300k homes. This is going to allow all of the upper middle class young white couples (frankly, like me) to get in before anyone else. The only houses coming after these will be 600K house and tiny homes. Which again will both probably have some early access that will limit the people who can afford the tiny homes from even getting a chance. I just think it's dumb. It makes sense though. This is really valuable land.

Same question. What are they doing to prevent upper middle class young couples of any other race from buying in?

Regardless, using moderately expensive and expensive homes to kickstart an expensive urban development certainly isn’t dumb from a business standpoint. They may add lower income housing to the development at some point but it would be pretty unrealistic to expect that type of housing to carry the development in early stages given the kind of structures they plan to start with.

If you ever thought there was going to be truly mixed level income price points on an ambitious development like this then jokes on you.

If you ever thought there was going to be truly mixed level income price points on an ambitious development like this then jokes on you.

It shouldnt. I mean they did get something like $70+ million in TIF money. They are highly subisdized, so they should offer truly affordable housing.

I agree with you. Esp about the TIF perspective, which I don't think they should have received anyways but that's for another thread.

All I am saying is that it's almost impossible to get in a brand new home for $150,000 in the burbs, let alone in a quality high end development near the center core. I have no doubt it will be mixed income levels. But the level will start at middle to upper middle class and go up from there, rather than starting lower.

Doesn’t $1,000 come close to a normal “good faith deposit” for building? I think we put down a $1,500
Deposit for our <$150,000 home we build in 2009.

I shouldn’t have included race in the discussion, and I regret that I did. It really has no bearing on my point.

^^^^^^
Good on you for owning it; I sincerely believe you and hope everyone else does too. We all occasionally choose our words poorly; lord knows I do. You're good people AP.

Folks I think a couple of things here DO need to be cleared up:


The deposit is fully refundable. The ONLY reason they are doing this is to make sure that during their initial release of plans they will ONLY be talking with people who are serious about possibly living here. Due to the visibility of the project and high degree of public interest, they are (I think legitimately) concerned that their sales team will be inundated with meetings with people who are simply curious, plus people who are genuinely and legitimately interested in what's happening there but not serious about home buying anytime soon, plus the inevitable lookieloos and tire kickers. They don't want the legitimately interested to be frustrated in their efforts. They also are looking to reward people who have been with them since day one on this project (3+ years), and feel that those people deserve a chance for an advance look at plans and a preferred shot at lot selection. Fair, if you ask me. The plans will be released publicly after Thanksgiving.


Regarding TIF, that is specifically directed at INFRASTRUCTURE REIMBURSEMENT. It's for things like public space, streets, utilities, that sort of thing. Remember, this is not a gated community; these are ultimately streets for public use. And before they see the reimbursement they have to create value where none existed (this is the nature of TIF). They likely won't recoup their infrastructure costs for 20 years. They will have already fronted many millions of dollars in development costs at that point.


Regarding affordable housing product, they are 100% committed to including it. In fact have made promises to that effect. You have to keep in mind that the plans and pricing they are getting ready to release are for the first 46 of what will be HUNDREDS of homes in this neighborhood, built over an estimated ten year period. This is a tiny slice of the pie. Also, don't forget that there will be multifamily. Finally, it is a development truism that you cannot lead with affordable product if you want true mixed-income housing. That is, you will never have difficulty attracting lower incomes to a neighborhood perceived to be better than the price point offered, but you will have a nearly impossible time luring higher incomes to a place established as primarily affordable. This neighborhood is already working in a non-traditional location for middle to upper income, and they have to convince those buyers now that this is a good location choice. Effectively the early-adopting middle-to-upper income buyers will legitimize the neighborhood for those to come, regardless of income. There DEFINITELY will be more affordable product, and it's not limited to tiny homes.

Thanks for the clarification, Urbanized. I appreciate your insight.

[QUOTE=Urbanized;1010121 Finally, it is a development truism that you cannot lead with affordable product if you want true mixed-income housing. That is, you will never have difficulty attracting lower incomes to a neighborhood perceived to be better than the price point offered, but you will have a nearly impossible time luring higher incomes to a place established as primarily affordable. This neighborhood is already working in a non-traditional location for middle to upper income, and they have to convince those buyers now that this is a good location choice. Effectively the early-adopting middle-to-upper income buyers will legitimize the neighborhood for those to come, regardless of income. There DEFINITELY will be more affordable product, and it's not limited to tiny homes.
[/QUOTE]

"but you will have a nearly impossible time luring higher incomes to a place established as primarily affordable"

I think this is the most important piece of the puzzle. If we remember the early days of Deep Deuce, once everything was cleared, you had the Deep Deuce apartments and that was about it. Then, the Brownstones and The Hill started, both were on the upper end of the price point. Once the interest was there, you saw the lofts at Maywood, Level, Maywood apartments, etc. This is the same type of time frame and I couldn't have put it any better than Chad did. Thanks for the insight.

Finally, it is a development truism that you cannot lead with affordable product if you want true mixed-income housing. That is, you will never have difficulty attracting lower incomes to a neighborhood perceived to be better than the price point offered, but you will have a nearly impossible time luring higher incomes to a place established as primarily affordable. This neighborhood is already working in a non-traditional location for middle to upper income, and they have to convince those buyers now that this is a good location choice. Effectively the early-adopting middle-to-upper income buyers will legitimize the neighborhood for those to come, regardless of income. There DEFINITELY will be more affordable product, and it's not limited to tiny homes.
[/LIST]

I think this is the most important piece of the puzzle. If we remember the early days of Deep Deuce, once everything was cleared, you had the Deep Deuce apartments and that was about it. Then, the Brownstones and The Hill started, both were on the upper end of the price point. Once the interest was there, you saw the lofts at Maywood, Level, Maywood apartments, etc. This is the same type of time frame and I couldn't have put it any better than Chad did. Thanks for the insight.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheeler111217.jpg

The Oklahoman has an article with renderings on for sale properties but it is behind a pay wall. Pete, is this something you are working on?

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheeler111917a.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheeler111917b.jpg


http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/wheeler111917c.jpg

I'll be glad when we see what kind of houses/homes are going to be built in this first phase. Hopefully it looks like the drawings that were released a few years ago that have the European look

I'll be glad when we see what kind of houses/homes are going to be built in this first phase. Hopefully it looks like the drawings that were released a few years ago that have the European look

The renderings in today's paper were not in my opinion the European look. From what I saw it was 2 and 3 floor stand alone. Not really much to see in the paper today.

I went to the Wheeler Block Party yesterday. There was a very good turnout, with people receiving packets containing floor plans, pricing information, and diagrams on where the lots will be located. There were many representatives from Wheeler on hand to answer questions. I thought the floor plans were very well laid out and it sounds like the construction quality will be among the best in OKC. The pricing for the plans I saw was in the $200 to $210 per square foot range, so definitely on the higher side for OKC. Anyone else on here attend?

I went to the Wheeler Block Party yesterday. There was a very good turnout, with people receiving packets containing floor plans, pricing information, and diagrams on where the lots will be located. There were many representatives from Wheeler on hand to answer questions. I thought the floor plans were very well laid out and it sounds like the construction quality will be among the best in OKC. The pricing for the plans I saw was in the $200 to $210 per square foot range, so definitely on the higher side for OKC. Anyone else on here attend?

I also went. I'm a big fan of the designs. They are a nice mixture of modern and traditional and there is a good variation, both in designs and floor plans. I think this development will be very successful. I'm considering three of midsized plans. I wish I could get the top end house. It's huge and looks great.

I also went. I'm a big fan of the designs. They are a nice mixture of modern and traditional and there is a good variation, both in designs and floor plans. I think this development will be very successful. I'm considering three of midsized plans. I wish I could get the top end house. It's huge and looks great.

Definitely a lot of good options. Really like the top end house. I wish there were more 4 bedroom options, as I think it may have been the only one.

I went to the Wheeler Block Party yesterday. There was a very good turnout, with people receiving packets containing floor plans, pricing information, and diagrams on where the lots will be located. There were many representatives from Wheeler on hand to answer questions. I thought the floor plans were very well laid out and it sounds like the construction quality will be among the best in OKC. The pricing for the plans I saw was in the $200 to $210 per square foot range, so definitely on the higher side for OKC. Anyone else on here attend?

Higher end pricing, along with the fact that they will be efficiently (small, tight lots) packing in the homes on every street...sure glad they are getting up to $65 million in TIF money to get this done. Not sure how else they'd make any money at it when they're getting high margins and utilizing good economies of scale (sarcasm). Makes you wonder how any home builder can make money without the city's and taxpayer's help (more sarcasm).

Higher end pricing, along with the fact that they will be efficiently (small, tight lots) packing in the homes on every street...sure glad they are getting up to $65 million in TIF money to get this done. Not sure how else they'd make any money at it when they're getting high margins and utilizing good economies of scale (sarcasm). Makes you wonder how any home builder can make money without the city's and taxpayer's help (more sarcasm).

See post # 1485 - this is explained in detail. Not sure why you keep bringing it up ?

See post # 1485 - this is explained in detail. Not sure why you keep bringing it up ?

Because its still a bad deal? I could see a few million, maybe even $10 million in a TIF but over $60 million is just absurd. A tif doesnt have to pay for nearly every street and utility. If so, why doesnt every new development get it? You mention this TIF going to public streets and spaces, but thats what nearly all private developments do, create public roads and spaces. Whats different about this one? This is a dense designed neighborhood on suitably located land, it will sell itself. They arent re-inventing the wheel here, so I dont know why it needs this much taxpayer money to be successful. And to get $60 million in TIF funds you would at least think home prices would be below $200/ft.

I know the TIF has already been approved and I am wasting my time but I keep mentioning this to at least bring a little more scrutiny to some of the TIF deals the city has done. They make sense in some scenarios, but in some scenarios they dont, and certainly in many scenarios the large dollar amount doesnt make sense at all.

I feel like this area was so blighted if any place should qualify for it then this should be the candidate. I'm not sure how much is fair, but this development could be a true catalyst for south of the river.