There's already one of those I thought

Here is an update by Steve



- OKC Central Chat transcript, Aug. 22, 2014 | News OK (http://newsok.com/okc-central-chat-transcript-aug.-22-2014/article/5334791)

Also, shouldn't this thread be renamed 'Wheeler District'?
Why, because Blair Humphrey's says it's the Wheeler District now? The site has been and still is called the Downtown Airpark. Maybe when some real development starts taking place I could see it, but until something takes place, I don't see a need for Pete to change it.

Why, because Blair Humphrey's says it's the Wheeler District now? The site has been and still is called the Downtown Airpark. Maybe when some real development starts taking place I could see it, but until something takes place, I don't see a need for Pete to change it.

Well they own it, so they could call it Candyland if they wanted to. It would then be the proper name of the development.

Well they own it, so they could call it Candyland if they wanted to. It would then be the proper name of the development.

I vote for Candyland. But in all seriousness, they are leasing a major portion to a tenant, which does business as the Downtown Airpark, and as someone said, there is already a Wheeler District (fictitious district) at this point.

Does someone have access to share this article here?

Rolling out the details: Humphreys gives more insight into Wheeler District | The Journal Record (http://journalrecord.com/2014/09/11/rolling-out-the-details-humphreys-gives-more-insight-into-wheeler-district-real-estate/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)

Does someone have access to share this article here?

Rolling out the details: Humphreys gives more insight into Wheeler District | The Journal Record (http://journalrecord.com/2014/09/11/rolling-out-the-details-humphreys-gives-more-insight-into-wheeler-district-real-estate/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)

Rolling out the details: Humphreys gives more insight into Wheeler District

By: Molly M. Fleming The Journal Record September 11, 20140

OKLAHOMA CITY – Developer Blair Humphreys is finalizing the master plan for the Wheeler District, a mixed-use urban infill project that will be developed using outside-the-box planning ideas.

The 150-acre development will include 2,000 housing units, 200,000 square feet of retail space, bike paths and a Ferris wheel. The district stretches from Interstate 40 to SW 15th Street, west nearly to S. Douglas Avenue and east to Walker Avenue.

“This is very much a work in progress,” Humphreys said at the Commercial Real Estate Council monthly luncheon Thursday at the Oklahoma History Center.

Humphreys, who works for The Humphreys Fund, said he and his family see this as an opportunity to create a place where the streets are built for people rather than cars. He said this focus will help promote healthier lifestyles.

When the Wheeler District housing is complete in 2016 and the city’s Core to Shore park is finished, people will be able to access downtown from Wheeler without crossing a major thoroughfare.

“We see that as a really unique opportunity,” he said.

He said he and his family also think such accessibility could increase cycling to work. He said he doesn’t know many people who bike to work, but he thinks if the area is able to provide safe passages, interest could grow.

Residents will be able to do more than simply walk or bike through a park, however. They will be able to live near many green spaces that are planned. Humphreys’ city blocks will be 180 by 240 feet, which is much smaller than Oklahoma City’s, which typically measure 300 by 400 feet.

“We’re operating at about 50 percent of open space and infrastructure load,” he said. “Typically it’s about 35 percent. That means I have to make up for that extra by providing value.”

Equity Realty Realtor Judy Hatfield said she thinks Humphreys will be able to do that with the amenities he has planned and the housing he will build.

Humphreys has said he wants to build one- to three-story homes. The home design aesthetic will not have a central theme, he said. He also expects to offer a variety of home prices, appealing to different income levels.

“This will not compete with Midtown or downtown,” he said. “We think there’s a way to provide something that fits the market.”

He said he’s considered pocket neighborhoods and other eclectic homes. In a pocket neighborhood, seven or eight homes share a large green area. He wants to have a mix of owned and leased homes.

“We need that kind of housing,” Hatfield said. “Right now, we don’t have anything that’s affordable. We need some things that our worker bees can live in and have transportation to get to their jobs.”

Humphreys has asked for the public’s opinion on the space since he started the planning process. People can submit ideas at wheelerdistrict.com. He has made changes to the plan as he’s heard ideas. One request was for the Downtown Airpark’s old runway to be remembered. It will be turned into a tree-lined avenue.

Hatfield said she thinks Humphreys’ project will work well in Oklahoma City.

“I admire the work (Humphreys) and his family has put together on this project,” she said. “With that kind of support and that kind of brain power, I feel very comfortable that they will find a way to make this work successfully.”

double post

Humphreys spoke to the Midtown Rotary yesterday so I thought I would bring this topic back. I have seen multiple times that the price for houses in the Wheeler District will not compete with downtown and midtown. With that being said, what kind of price does everyone think we are looking at? The Hill at Bricktown comes in around $230 a foot, and Block 42 comes in around $170 a foot. Any thoughts?

Did he have any new information to share about the master plan?

Humphreys spoke to the Midtown Rotary yesterday so I thought I would bring this topic back. I have seen multiple times that the price for houses in the Wheeler District will not compete with downtown and midtown. With that being said, what kind of price does everyone think we are looking at? The Hill at Bricktown comes in around $230 a foot, and Block 42 comes in around $170 a foot. Any thoughts?

IIRC, the homes at Carlton Landing go for about $160 per SF.

I've ever been wondering about this project as well. Can't wait to see it get underway. Is it still scheduled to start next year?

Humphreys spoke to the Midtown Rotary yesterday so I thought I would bring this topic back. I have seen multiple times that the price for houses in the Wheeler District will not compete with downtown and midtown. With that being said, what kind of price does everyone think we are looking at? The Hill at Bricktown comes in around $230 a foot, and Block 42 comes in around $170 a foot. Any thoughts?

I've heard from a good friend of mine who consulted on the project that there will be a range of prices for apartments and house. So, we are probably looking at both of those plus a little higher and lower.

It would be great to see a price below $170 per foot. Do we really think they could sell close to 1000 homes near $200 foot? I know the OKC housing market is on fire but that seems like a very tall order.

From Steve's chat today.


Gary T - 1:51 p.m.
Good afternoon! Blair and Todd: what kind of timeline do you have for the Wheeler development, i.e. financing in place, more specific renderings and groundbreaking?
1:54 p.m.
Blair Humphreys: We're hoping to break ground in 2015. We hope to have people living and working in Wheeler by late 2016 or early 2017. Financing is in place. There should be a more refined master plan included with the PUD submittal in early 2015.



Blair/Todd: how do you plan to tackle the public schooling issues within the boundaries of Wheeler? Meaning, do you have long term thoughts for families that might want to live there but don't feel like there are good options for their kids (if they can't do private and don't want to home school)? Blair- how does your dad's work with MAPS for Kids affect your thinking around public education?
Blair Humphreys; Yes, we have thought a lot about education. We would definitely like to see a public school option. South OKC has an existing crowding situation at some of their public schools. We believe there is potential for a new charter school to serve families living on the southside and families moving into Wheeler. We are very excited about the potential of a duel emersion charter school that would be able to serve children with English as a first language and Spanish as a first language. We are still in the very early stages, so there needs to be a conversation with city and community leaders and elected leadership and administrators of the school district. We are certainly interested in offering a site and we would be thrilled to have such a school in our community.


As Someone who went to Mount St Mary's next to Wheeler District I am curious what kind of plans do you have to connect to the neighborhood, the school and eventually capitol hill? The district will already be so special with its place making and the ferris wheel but I see the ability to change the areas surrounding it.
Blair Humphreys: One of the takeaways from the charette is that community stakeholders from the surrounding neighborhoods as well as people considering moving into Wheeler all want to see as much connecdtion as possible between Wheeler and the surrounding neighborhoods when the project is completed. The plan includes a new east west connection on 15th from McKinley to Waklker, connections west to the Rotary Park neighborhood, and specifically, relating to Mount St. Mary, an opportunity for a connection south along Shartel.


There seemed to be a lot of interest in Wheeler during the chat today.

A dual-immersion school would be a grand slam. Super impressive vision on their part.

I think the name of this should be changed to the Wheeler District. Anyhow, I received this email.

https://scontent-b-dfw.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/1510529_10204470137225992_7393919410613599171_n.jp g?oh=f02b402e8e4a0a30befa627954abb2e4&oe=5544A203

Very glad to see they are going to be using LED lights.

Wow, that is big time news. Had no idea they planned to install the ferris wheel so soon, but a great strategy to garner interest & financial investments for this project.

No kidding, that'll be an excellent start to the district. I can't wait to see it actually in place, we've been hearing about that ferris wheel for so long it kind of feels like a myth at this point.

Would be neat if they could make the wheel a stop for the river cruisers, but I don't think there is anywhere to dock over there at the moment right?

Such a great idea to get the ferris wheel up and running, especially with new lighting effects.

Will add instant activity and interest to the area while they are trying to get the first elements off the ground.

Even if they don't get many riders in the beginning, it will be a focal point and beacon for the entire area.

New MAPS 4 suggestion... 2 new pedestrian bridges, 1 that goes over the river from the new ferris wheel location/wheeler district vicinity, and another that goes over I-40, along with a pedestrian corridor (maybe as an alignment with Klein south of SW 3rd St) that goes from the north end of that second bridge straight into the heart of the farmers market. You could also have a ramp up to the bridge or some other form of connectivity from the crosswalk crossing Western from the street exiting Wheeler Park so that there's a friendly way to get from the Wheeler District to the park. Doing all of this now-ish would make sure it was there so that once both districts are thriving they will be well interconnected for bikes and pedestrians.

^

Great idea.

There is a pedestrian path on the east side of western over the river. There is no "easy" access to it from the west side of western though. You currently have to go under the western bridge along the river path, and then hike back up a steep hill. (unless you wanna cross over western with no pedestrian crossings *gulp*)

A pedestrian only bridge would look cool though, but I bet it would be pretty expensive spanning the entire width of the river. I'm sure pedestrian access will be improved dramatically on Western though before all is said & done.

New MAPS 4 suggestion... 2 new pedestrian bridges, 1 that goes over the river from the new ferris wheel location/wheeler district vicinity, and another that goes over I-40, along with a pedestrian corridor (maybe as an alignment with Klein south of SW 3rd St) that goes from the north end of that second bridge straight into the heart of the farmers market. You could also have a ramp up to the bridge or some other form of connectivity from the crosswalk crossing Western from the street exiting Wheeler Park so that there's a friendly way to get from the Wheeler District to the park. Doing all of this now-ish would make sure it was there so that once both districts are thriving they will be well interconnected for bikes and pedestrians.

I was hoping that eventually the old rail bridge deck might be modified and connected into the trail system in that area, since the new i40 cut off the alignment it went to it no longer has any function.

I was hoping that eventually the old rail bridge deck might be modified and connected into the trail system in that area, since the new i40 cut off the alignment it went to it no longer has any function.

This would be an excellent re-use for that bridge. Would save millions.

I was hoping that eventually the old rail bridge deck might be modified and connected into the trail system in that area, since the new i40 cut off the alignment it went to it no longer has any function.

Someone give this man a prize, that is a fantastic idea. Just to make sure I'm imaging it correctly, this (https://www.google.com/maps/@35.4565376,-97.5336952,3a,75y,251.37h,79.81t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sFPwdjqjWKx8ZRH2jy7FMHA!2e0?hl= en) is what you're talking about, right?

Someone give this man a prize, that is a fantastic idea. Just to make sure I'm imaging it correctly, this (https://www.google.com/maps/@35.4565376,-97.5336952,3a,75y,251.37h,79.81t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sFPwdjqjWKx8ZRH2jy7FMHA!2e0?hl= en) is what you're talking about, right?

It is

Okay, I thought so. That is such a great idea, I'm sitting here wanting it to exist to I can go run on a trail over it.

Wait, is there nothing blocking access to that? I figured there was some kind of barricade...

I was hoping that eventually the old rail bridge deck might be modified and connected into the trail system in that area, since the new i40 cut off the alignment it went to it no longer has any function.

Great Idea, only questions would be:

1. Does the city or the rail company own the bridge?
2. Does the city have any plans to use this bridge in the future for a downtown to airport light rail system?
3. Is the wooden bridge structurally secure or would it be better to build new?

If you have ever taken the river boat or rowed down the Oklahoma River, there are several bridges (mainly the rail bridges) that need to be rebuilt because they are challenging to navigate through. The river would be much more pleasant if the bridges were built with support on land, not in the middle of the river flow.

My friend lives in Huntersville, NC in an area called Birkdale Village
Birkdale Village - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birkdale_Village)


Birkdale Village is a 52-acre (210,000 m2) new urbanist residential, retail and office mixed-use community located in Huntersville, North Carolina.[3] The town center functions as the hub of a 800-acre (3.2 km2) new town that includes 4 communities of 2000 single-family homes and town houses. Included within the town center are 454,000 sq ft (42,200 m2). of retail and incidental office space, as well as 340 units of multi-family housing. Birkdale village is also located on the McDowell Creek Greenway, which provides walking and nature trails for re99119912sidents while preserving the water quality of nearby McDowell Creek.

Will Wheeler District be anything like this?

My friend lives in Huntersville, NC in an area called Birkdale Village
Birkdale Village - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birkdale_Village)



Will Wheeler District be anything like this?

There are those kind of developments all over the Charlotte metro area. It would be great for something like that to be built here.

I do not have any confidence in Blair Humphreys and his connections to make this happen. He has parlayed his dads stint as mayor into some connections, but I have heard a lot of noise from BH with little to no completed projects

Great Idea, only questions would be:

1. Does the city or the rail company own the bridge?
2. Does the city have any plans to use this bridge in the future for a downtown to airport light rail system?
3. Is the wooden bridge structurally secure or would it be better to build new?

If you have ever taken the river boat or rowed down the Oklahoma River, there are several bridges (mainly the rail bridges) that need to be rebuilt because they are challenging to navigate through. The river would be much more pleasant if the bridges were built with support on land, not in the middle of the river flow.

1) it looks like it was co owned by BSNF & Stillwater Central, not sure of the percentages.
2) really doubtful, both i40 and a berm for the approach to the bridge over i40 make it a huge expense to try to connect that bridge to the hub downtown, especially since there is already an existing line that goes from Santa Fe station to around a mile north of the airport and looks like it has room for an additional lines if they rail company wanted us to use a separate line.
3) it was secure enough to handle it's own weight and that of a cargo train as of at five years ago, a lot of the rail bridges have at least 100 year lifespans and less train usage could extend that (it would have been built sometime around the 1950's when the channel was created).

I have rowed downtown so I know how tight that bridge style is for rowing, however far less people row in that basin verses the east basin and when OU holds their sprint invitational in that basin the use the area around May to Penn. It would be nice for wider spans but the lock is by far the most restrictive item for the river cruisers. Removing the massive steel beams under the deck and the piles is going to be expensive for little return, which is why they were not even bother to be removed by the rail companies. Plus it might even be worth it for the rail companies to donate it to the city, since it pretty much is just a liability hazard to them at this point.

I do not have any confidence in Blair Humphreys and his connections to make this happen. He has parlayed his dads stint as mayor into some connections, but I have heard a lot of noise from BH with little to no completed projects

This is his first project as a developer... You must have something personal against him.

1) it looks like it was co owned by BSNF & Stillwater Central, not sure of the percentages.
2) really doubtful, both i40 and a berm for the approach to the bridge over i40 make it a huge expense to try to connect that bridge to the hub downtown, especially since there is already an existing line that goes from Santa Fe station to around a mile north of the airport and looks like it has room for an additional lines if they rail company wanted us to use a separate line.
3) it was secure enough to handle it's own weight and that of a cargo train as of at five years ago, a lot of the rail bridges have at least 100 year lifespans and less train usage could extend that (it would have been built sometime around the 1950's when the channel was created).

I have rowed downtown so I know how tight that bridge style is for rowing, however far less people row in that basin verses the east basin and when OU holds their sprint invitational in that basin the use the area around May to Penn. It would be nice for wider spans but the lock is by far the most restrictive item for the river cruisers. Removing the massive steel beams under the deck and the piles is going to be expensive for little return, which is why they were not even bother to be removed by the rail companies. Plus it might even be worth it for the rail companies to donate it to the city, since it pretty much is just a liability hazard to them at this point.

Reaching back to my memory, I think this bridge was conveyed to OKC as part of all of the Crosstown work. I think the City's long term intention was to use it as a trail connection, but I'd need to do some research to be sure.

Reaching back to my memory, I think this bridge was conveyed to OKC as part of all of the Crosstown work. I think the City's long term intention was to use it as a trail connection, but I'd need to do some research to be sure.

That would not surprise me, I had just looked at the map ODOT has for rail in it's maps section. After going back and looking at the date, it was made in 2011.

I do not have any confidence in Blair Humphreys and his connections to make this happen. He has parlayed his dads stint as mayor into some connections, but I have heard a lot of noise from BH with little to no completed projects

Noise? Like asking what people would like to see in this development and what they would pay for housing? You say noise, I say market research...

Someone give this man a prize, that is a fantastic idea. Just to make sure I'm imaging it correctly, this (https://www.google.com/maps/@35.4565376,-97.5336952,3a,75y,251.37h,79.81t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sFPwdjqjWKx8ZRH2jy7FMHA!2e0?hl= en) is what you're talking about, right?

I suggested use of that bridge as a pedestrian connection at least three years ago when that line was severed... I even drew up a plan and posted it on here (this site...somewhere) with cloverleaf pedestrian ramps from the trails.

Don't say the word cloverleaf. PluPan will blow a gasket.

Don't say the word cloverleaf. PluPan will blow a gasket.

LMAO, yeah, I thought about that. That's why I posted it!

Make it a 5 stack cloverleaf and he will get out there and help build it. :)

Did someone say 5 stack!!!!!!! ;)

Did someone say 5 stack!!!!!!! ;)

Calm down, plupan. They were talking about pancakes. LOL

I do not have any confidence in Blair Humphreys and his connections to make this happen. He has parlayed his dads stint as mayor into some connections, but I have heard a lot of noise from BH with little to no completed projects


This is his first project as a developer... You must have something personal against him.
Man, no kidding. If you don't have something personal against him then - no offense - you are speaking from a place of absolute ignorance.

Man, no kidding. If you don't have something personal against him then - no offense - you are speaking from a place of absolute ignorance.

LOL. No kidding. I'm sure it was Kirk's term as mayor in OKC that got him into MIT. Hahaha.

This is his first project as a developer... You must have something personal against him.

Are you not counting Carlton's Landing since it's not in OKC?

Are you not counting Carlton's Landing since it's not in OKC?

Carlton's Landing was not developed by Blair, but by his brother Grant.

I do not have any confidence in Blair Humphreys and his connections to make this happen. He has parlayed his dads stint as mayor into some connections, but I have heard a lot of noise from BH with little to no completed projects

Ever spend a week hanging around Blair and his team working on this? If not, you should do that the next time they do. I would say likely next year for sure.

Are you not counting Carlton's Landing since it's not in OKC?

I visited Carlton Landing recently. They have a good start. It's a long way from realization of the larger concept, but the long term plan is a 30 year plan I was told. Grant is managing that one. Blair would be managing WD but it's still all in the same company. I don't believe they will have much trouble developing Wheeler District do to lack of competence if they don't misjudge the market or get tangled up in economic issues beyond their control. Ditto for Carlton Landing long term.

Also, Carlton Landing is 1,650 acres. The Wheeler District is 150. Carlton Landing in on a Lake so it is probably more for retirees and second homes. The Wheeler District is two miles from DT OKC. One is going to take a lot more time than the other...

Man, no kidding. If you don't have something personal against him then - no offense - you are speaking from a place of absolute ignorance.

Nothing against him, just seems to be a young guy with grandeous ideas, I don't place much faith in those two traits alone.

POST ABOVE
I visited Carlton Landing recently. They have a good start. IT'S A LONG WAY FROM REALIZATION OF THE LARGER CONCEPT, BUT THE LONG TERM PLAN IS A 30 YEAR PLAN I WAS TOLD. Grant is managing that one

LOL. No kidding. I'm sure it was Kirk's term as mayor in OKC that got him into MIT. Hahaha.

I'm going to guess you're an extremely jealous ignoramus. Blair is a super nice and humble guy.

Blair's work at MIT, OU, and ULI speak for itself. I do wonder if the market can handle the level of density originally envisioned during the charette process.

I'm going to guess you're an extremely jealous ignoramus. Blair is a super nice and humble guy.

Super nice and humble alone won't make this district a reality. I am not sayiing he is not a good guy, but bigger, heavier hitters than this guy have tried and failed in OKC to bring to fruition projects like this. Any idea where his MONEY is coming from? This is just a concept, people are talking like it is a definite. This may be realized in 10-15 years not before

Eight years have passed since the Humphreys family bought the former Downtown Airpark during a bankruptcy auction with plans to create a retail and housing development called “The Waterfront.”

Partners in the venture changed. The market changed.

Blair's work at MIT, OU, and ULI speak for itself. I do wonder if the market can handle the level of density originally envisioned during the charette process.

Charlotte has several of these developments and Memphis has at least one that I am familiar with. I am sure OKC could support this. It may not be able to support this AND another competing development.

It's disheartening when people still say that something would never work in OKC that has worked in peer and smaller cities.

Blair has stated they have financing in place, plan to break ground in 2015 with people living in the area in 2016. From my understanding, they are going to be redeveloping the space and breaking them off into lots then having someone else do the construction under supervision for style of construction. That is where they will make money, off the sale of the lots, like other developers. We are not looking at a bunch of Edmond style zero lot line homes. A lot of them will probably be townhomes. Think of The Hill or Block 42 with retail on the ground level.

Super nice and humble alone won't make this district a reality. I am not sayiing he is not a good guy, but bigger, heavier hitters than this guy have tried and failed in OKC to bring to fruition projects like this. Any idea where his MONEY is coming from? This is just a concept, people are talking like it is a definite. This may be realized in 10-15 years not before

Eight years have passed since the Humphreys family bought the former Downtown Airpark during a bankruptcy auction with plans to create a retail and housing development called “The Waterfront.”

Partners in the venture changed. The market changed.

This whole conversation is weird.

Blair has stated they have financing in place, plan to break ground in 2015 with people living in the area in 2016.
The timeline at the top of their webpage says a complete neighborhood in ten years and then includes a fifty year milestone for "It's Wheeler. A place people love."

Maybe we can declare the overall concept a success somewhere between the two.

Wheeler District (http://wheelerdistrict.com/)




From my understanding, they are going to be redeveloping the space and breaking them off into lots then having someone else do the construction under supervision for style of construction. That is where they will make money, off the sale of the lots, like other developers. We are not looking at a bunch of Edmond style zero lot line homes. A lot of them will probably be townhomes. Think of The Hill or Block 42 with retail on the ground level.

Will a TIF be involved? I have limited understanding of developer subsidies but things I wonder about at both WD and CL, how much will tax subsidy play a role in profitability? Assuming they get a return on property tax of some sort, would that be based on the property value of the built property rather than just the lot? In other words, they sell a lot for $150K and the new owner builds a $300K town home using new owner's builder and financing, is the value of property taxes returned to the developer for the next umpteen years based on the $150K lot or the $450K townhome? My guess is the later, or perhaps I misunderstand the whole process altogether.

(I've been meaning to research this issue on CL but haven't.)

Pete, pick up the white courtesy phone.