I bet you're a blast at dinner parties.

I can't tell you how awful that $3 wine is. We aren't missing out on anything.

I like it enough and the price is right. So I assume this TJ's just won't sell any wine?

They can't sell wine in the store but they may work out some type of work-around and have an adjacent liquor store.

But I haven't heard anything specifically about that.

They can't sell wine in the store but they may work out some type of work-around and have an adjacent liquor store.

But I haven't heard anything specifically about that.

In Minneapolis (which is probably TJ's ideal market) they have a separate store for wine and liquor. Doesn't seem to hurt them a bit.

I bet you're a blast at dinner parties.

I can't tell you how awful that $3 wine is. We aren't missing out on anything.

Ha. I just enjoy a decent wine selection at theat price point for random bottles. I prefer the good stuff as well.

I thought Fresh Market would be a great fit for the old Crescent Market but I'm not opposed to Trader Joe's moving in there. Just hope that Trader Joe's has more than three working employees compared to Aldi's.

OKCTalk - Trader Joe's and REI coming to OKC (http://www.okctalk.com/content.php?r=107-Trader-Joe-s-and-REI-coming-to-OKC)

Yaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

In Minneapolis (which is probably TJ's ideal market) they have a separate store for wine and liquor. Doesn't seem to hurt them a bit.

The only one in Denver with wine/beer/liquor has a separate entrance and checkout counter. All of the other ones in Colorado do not have any wine/beer/liquor.

The only one in Denver with wine/beer/liquor has a separate entrance and checkout counter. All of the other ones in Colorado do not have any wine/beer/liquor.

Ya that's what I meant. Same building, two entrances. I actually walked into that entrance on accident on multiple occasions.

Ya that's what I meant. Same building, two entrances. I actually walked into that entrance on accident on multiple occasions.

Can't.

Liquor store owners must be sole props and a resident of oklahoma for 10 years. Best case is an adjacent which I would guess is pretty likely.

Trader Joe's and REI are denying any move to OKC, according to reporters at The Oklahoman.

I assume this is just normal business PR process until an official announcement is ready to be made, because I'm approximately 1023% sure Pete wouldn't just throw it out there like he did without solid information. Kind of like Devon Energy saying there weren't going to build a tower...

What they are saying is they have no announcements.

My sources are very, very good.

A deal can always fall apart -- it happens even after formal announcements -- but I have high confidence in what I reported.

What they are saying is they have no announcements.

My sources are very, very good.

A deal can always fall apart -- it happens even after formal announcements -- but I have high confidence in what I reported.

Tom George, a reporter for OKC Fox, says, "Trader Joes corporate office in California says no plans for OKC Trader Joes at this time." And Paul Monies, of The Oklahoman, says "Sorry, REI and Trader Joe's fans in OKC. Looks like the companies are batting down rumors." He then links to a Journal Record tweet that says REI has not made any announcements, which is true, just like Pete said.

Given track records, I'd put money on Pete's information. And, to be frank, I think what certain reporters are saying (one mocked "trusting internet message boards"--hilarious) on Twitter is probably driven by varying emotions at being scooped by OKCTalk.

This Street View was taken right before our Trader Joe's opened up. https://www.google.com/maps/@47.636606,-122.356916,3a,75y,123.5h,90.32t/data=!3m4!1e1!3m2!1sxJ9iK9DVYJz1vNu_ItArvQ!2e0!6m1 !1e1

Man, look at all those overhead ugly wires... :)

WinCo was reported on OKCTalk almost a year before formal announcements were made.

Channel 5 running the story with quotes from the Nichols Hills mayor and no credit to OKCTalk:


Trader Joe's store coming to Oklahoma (http://www.koco.com/news/trader-joes-store-coming-to-oklahoma/31138620?absolute=true&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=koconews)
Published 4:24 PM CST Feb 06, 2015

NICHOLS HILLS, Okla. —Trader Joe’s is set to move into Nichols Hills Plaza.

After years of rumors, Mayor Sody Clements finally got the good news Friday.

Many Oklahomans have been driving to Dallas to shop at the specialty store, buying things like cookie butter, organic ketchup and Unexpected Cheddar Cheese.

It will be the first Trader Joe’s in Oklahoma.

The company signed a letter of intent to lease the space at Nichols Hills Plaza. The city operates solely on sales tax, and the extra money will go a long way toward making the community better.

“We have our own police department, fire department and public works with our streets," Clements said. "And all of those are based on sales tax. So we’re happy to have them here for that.”

Although exact plans haven’t been revealed, Clements hopes this addition will be the first of many for the area.

“I think it will be great to have this gathering spot back again," she said.

The same company also has plans to open a Recreational Equipment Incorporated store, commonly known as REI, in a new development just south of where Trader Joe’s will be.

Channel 5 running the story with quotes from the Nichols Hills mayor and no credit to OKCTalk:


Trader Joe's store coming to Oklahoma (http://www.koco.com/news/trader-joes-store-coming-to-oklahoma/31138620?absolute=true&utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter&utm_campaign=koconews)
Published 4:24 PM CST Feb 06, 2015

NICHOLS HILLS, Okla. —Trader Joe’s is set to move into Nichols Hills Plaza.

After years of rumors, Mayor Sody Clements finally got the good news Friday.

Many Oklahomans have been driving to Dallas to shop at the specialty store, buying things like cookie butter, organic ketchup and Unexpected Cheddar Cheese.

It will be the first Trader Joe’s in Oklahoma.

The company signed a letter of intent to lease the space at Nichols Hills Plaza. The city operates solely on sales tax, and the extra money will go a long way toward making the community better.

“We have our own police department, fire department and public works with our streets," Clements said. "And all of those are based on sales tax. So we’re happy to have them here for that.”

Although exact plans haven’t been revealed, Clements hopes this addition will be the first of many for the area.

“I think it will be great to have this gathering spot back again," she said.

The same company also has plans to open a Recreational Equipment Incorporated store, commonly known as REI, in a new development just south of where Trader Joe’s will be.

This is basically a form of plagiarizing, in my opinion. They stole OKCTalk's work and just threw in some quotes from the mayor. Ridiculous.

WinCo was reported on OKCTalk almost a year before formal announcements were made.

They still haven't formally announced anything other than they plan to enter the market sometime in the future.

And they only said that after they bought the property in Midwest City under their own name; a very property we had identified months earlier.

https://twitter.com/briOKC/status/563843076980895744

Man, look at all those overhead ugly wires... :)

Trolleybuses in Seattle - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trolleybuses_in_Seattle)

http://rasmussen.seattle.gov/wp-content/uploads/2011/06/Metro-trolley.jpg

I'm glad to hear Trader Joe's is finally coming to OKC but I'm really excited and surprised that REI is on it's way!! I've never been to either but I've read many good things about them. REI actually has a good reputation for bicycles and they carry Surly's, which are very hard to find for test rides. They can't open their doors fast enough for me!

https://twitter.com/briOKC/status/563843076980895744

That's probably what they have to say until they are ready to formally announce. Brianna said she thought they were close to a deal in Tulsa yet the official statement from Trader Joe's is that Tulsa isn't in their expansion plans in the next two years. I wouldn't put much stock in her.

It's Brianna's job to track these stories and try and get comment.

She's just reporting what she learned and of course these companies aren't going to confirm at this point.

Man, look at all those overhead ugly wires... :)

Yep. (Regardless of the desirability of the underlying purpose.) Overhead wires remind me of this R. Crumb series. (I like it better without the Joni Mitchell soundtrack.)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mRkq595NhD0



OB topic: This should be an REI thread. Trader Joes is good news but nothing like getting an REI!

I have no reason to think that Steve was referring to this in his chat today but this was a comment he made when asked about why complicated deals take time.


I think there is a lot of confusion that is only getting worse due to the growth of various sources of rumors and information on the Internet. I've witnessed some people who put out a rumor that a lease has been signed when in fact it's only a letter of intent. So you have people put out reports of letters of intent as done deals, and then nothing happens, or the actual deal doesn't break for months or is delayed for a couple of years. And those who hear prematurely about such deals get frustrated and wonder "why is it taking so long?" A developer told me early on in my career they could paper their walls with letters of intent. That's when I was tracking a Planet Hollywood and then a Dick Clark's American Bandstand Cafe that had letters of intent. A letter of intent simply means the potential tenant is interested. But there is no contract. And the deal is far from done. Sometimes the deal is killed by those higher up in the company. Other deals may collapse due to financing, or a change in the economy. Chains also have schedules they follow on store openings, and not making one calendar may result in the deal not looking so good in the next calendar. Or, as with an Albertson's that was once planned for NW 23 and Walker where The Rise is now, a change in which company real estate executive is in charge at the moment may cause a deal to tank.


I'm sure this at least comes into play when he or Brianna report on various potential developments.

I thought Fresh Market would be a great fit for the old Crescent Market but I'm not opposed to Trader Joe's moving in there. Just hope that Trader Joe's has more than three working employees compared to Aldi's.
The one that we have been to in Greenwood Village (with no beer or wine) has always had a bunch of people working in the store, from registers open to people stocking the store. They may be owned by the same company but they are run completely different.

TJ's had a reputation for employing friendly, smiling people and providing great customer service.

People that work there generally love the place.

I just came back from TJs and I can attest that they are very friendly and helpful. I don't shop there often, but I have to admit, they do an excellent customer service job. If you like cheese and wines and interesting appetizers and a very good dairy selection, they are place to go. The one by my house is probably 1/4 wine so will be interesting to see if they have a smaller store in OKC or offer additional food stuff than my location in the 'burbs of San Diego.

Good lord, it better be true this time. 'Tis all I've got to say.

These national chains who keep passing up OKC - well, if they don't want to come here and make a bunch of money, that's their problem, not ours.

Just saw the news on KOCO... and of course OKC Talk is the original source! It is extremely NOT cool of them to NOT give credit :mad:
So after reading all the newest posts since yesterday... this is still official, right?
At least 99.9% confirmed??
And people will stop going :ot: in this darn thread (although now it seems REI will be mentioned often but I'll take that over the Aldi hate :rolleyes: ) and make my heart jump every time it's at the top of the page???!

This is why I believe in God. He answers my OKC retail prayers. :D

...

Given track records, I'd put money on Pete's information. And, to be frank, I think what certain reporters are saying (one mocked "trusting internet message boards"--hilarious) on Twitter is probably driven by varying emotions at being scooped by OKCTalk.

This. Wife's words were pretty much "Too bad none of the real newspapers got the story first", and she works for one of the real newspapers, funny!

So...you guys know that this is the way it works in the media every day, right? TV news doesn't employ people who watch public records for real estate transactions, for instance. They don't have real estate reporters.

The way it works is that they have an editorial meeting every morning, and an assignment editor points out articles in a newspaper, and sends a reporter to go cover it for that evening's news. It happens literally every day. And so rarely do they credit the original news source that it is fair to call it next to never.

That's one of the reasons sources want coverage from the newspaper first. If they get a front page of business - or even better a regular front page - TV will then go out and get follow-ups packaged as breaking. One, two, or if they're lucky three stations will cover it AND they were in the paper. That is what the seasoned developer or PR person is looking for. News conferences are timed around the desired exposure. Deals are made.

Seriously, once source grabbing the other's story and covering it without saying "as reported first at.." is just another day for media, and it especially happens to newspaper reporters.

Now, if they lift verbiage, or use quotes without citing them original source, that's a whole other thing...

So...you guys know that this is the way it works in the media every day, right? TV news doesn't employ people who watch public records for real estate transactions, for instance. They don't have real estate reporters.

The way it works is that they have an editorial meeting every morning, and an assignment editor points out articles in a newspaper, and sends a reporter to go cover it for that evening's news. It happens literally every day. And so rarely do they credit the original news source that it is fair to call it next to never.

That's one of the reasons sources want coverage from the newspaper first. If they get a front page of business - or even better a regular front page - TV will then go out and get follow-ups packaged as breaking. One, two, or if they're lucky three stations will cover it AND they were in the paper. That is what the seasoned developer or PR person is looking for. News conferences are timed around the desired exposure. Deals are made.

Seriously, once source grabbing the other's story and covering it without saying "as reported first at.." is just another day for media, and it especially happens to newspaper reporters.

Now, if they lift verbiage, or use quotes without citing them original source, that's a whole other thing...
I didn't know that. Thanks for the info.

You're welcome, happy to help. Unless you've been around the news gathering or PR worlds, it's hard to know exactly how it all works.

Pete, as a guy who writes and has broken several big OU coaching stories the last couple of weeks and never gets cited by other sources of news, I feel for you. I also understand your frustration(assuming you get frustrated). When we break stories for our thefootballbrainiacs.com site, we get "reporters" reporting our stories as if they, themselves, broke it.

Pete, keep doing what you're doing. Love your work!

To put the Trader Joe's corporate denial in perspective, Trader Joe's has submitted building plans for Brookside in Tulsa, yet their company spokesman says Tulsa "is not in their 2 year plans".

City Hall Blog: I think Trader Joe's is coming to town, no matter what they say - Tulsa World: Homepage2 (http://www.tulsaworld.com/homepage2/city-hall-blog-i-think-trader-joe-s-is-coming/article_fa2f18d4-d900-51da-afcb-2ed9fbb4577a.html)

The Tulsa World reporter uploaded the filed plans and I can tell you by looking at them, I'm 100% sure this will be a Trader Joe's.

The company almost always puts it's shelving at an angle (unusual for grocery stores), has a demo station in a corner, has flowers to the right when you walk in, has freezer cases facing each other in the middle of the store... This is almost a carbon copy of the TJ's nearest me and very similar to almost all their stores.

And just by coincidence, the architecture firm is out of Idaho and they've done past work for TJ's.

Most retailers want to handle PR about new locations on their own terms; have a big announcement and splash. And that often comes well after stores are under construction, if not just about to open.

As a reminder, WinCo has already closed on two properties in OKC and still hasn't officially announced anything.

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/tulsatjs.jpg

so Tulsa *IS* getting TJ's first


NNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO !!!!!!!!!!!

Not sure which would come first but the Tulsa location has to be cleared of existing tenants first.

I suspect they'll be working on both stores about the same time, as it leverages the various teams of people involved in the local setup.

Almost exact same thing happened with West Elm and several others. You can bet WinCo will do the same.


This was taken at a recent fundraiser but shows the old Crescent space. Not only is it cleared out, they've opened it up to the roof and installed new dormers. Will make a great TJ's:

https://fbcdn-sphotos-f-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-xpa1/v/t1.0-9/1380241_733952763309057_2850580768680683049_n.jpg? oh=c5227e36bfc74a741519e8287d4d7a8c&oe=54EB647C&__gda__=1425299521_10f8075edb8887af56fbb775da48943 c

And regarding the REI denial, they denied the Tulsa location as well but the City of Tulsa has in it's documents that it's been negotiating with them for a site on the river.

I'm sure the OKC and Tulsa stores will be in a pretty close time frame as well.

This is a recent image of the old Crescent space:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/crescent020815.jpg

Trader Joe's really is a perfect fit for that location. It will also be great for the city of Nichols Hills to bring in that tax revenue. I am sure they have been hurting since Aubrey cleared out NHP. It also seems to me that the OKC location is far more ready to go than the Tulsa location.

Created a new thread just for REI (http://www.okctalk.com/showwiki.php?title=REI).

I'm a little worried about the parking situation in NH Plaza South.

TJ"s brings in big crowds; even after a store has been open for a while.

They are going to eat up most the parking in that center. But, of course, most their locations out here have less parking and still thrive. But as I've mentioned, I would often skip going to several of their stores just because I couldn't get in the parking lot. Fortunately, the new one by me is much better in that respect (was just in there yesterday).

In case anyone doubts the interest in these stores, check out the numbers on our Facebook post... They are still growing:

http://www.okctalk.com/images/pete/fb020815.jpg

I'm a little worried about the parking situation in NH Plaza South.

TJ"s brings in big crowds; even after a store has been open for a while.

They are going to eat up most the parking in that center. But, of course, most their locations out here have less parking and still thrive. But as I've mentioned, I would often skip going to several of their stores just because I couldn't get in the parking lot. Fortunately, the new one by me is much better in that respect (was just in there yesterday).
The parking situation at the 8th & Colorado store seemed to ease after a couple of months, it was in the news a lot that first month and nothing since. When I have driven by there parking isn't an issue anymore even on Saturday. The first couple of months it was open it was a mess in the area, now you don't notice any change in traffic from before it opened, Colorado Blvd. in that area is always pretty busy but not jammed up constantly like the first month or so. The Greenwood Village store hasn't had any parking issues but it is in a pretty good sized big box mall. The GV store is never as busy as 8th & Colorado (the one with liquor). I think the newness has worn off and they are just getting regulars for the most part now.

The floor plan in your image looks a lot like the Greenwood Village layout to me.

I really hope they have an attached liquor store. I need to try this 2 buck chuck everyone is harping about.

It's going to be a beautiful day in my world. The sun will be shining, the birds will be singing and Trader Joe's has signed a letter of intent!

I'm a little worried about the parking situation in NH Plaza South.

TJ"s brings in big crowds; even after a store has been open for a while.

They are going to eat up most the parking in that center. But, of course, most their locations out here have less parking and still thrive. But as I've mentioned, I would often skip going to several of their stores just because I couldn't get in the parking lot. Fortunately, the new one by me is much better in that respect (was just in there yesterday).

Glimcher needs to find a way to tie NH Plaza, the Triangle and the Curve together in a pedestrian friendly way so that people can park in the Triangle, for instance, and walk to the Plaza. I'd thought of an underground walkway, but I'm sure they're extremely expensive to build and they would need 2 of them. Maybe they just need a little shuttle bus running continuously on weekends, for example. The Whole Foods parking lot is already frequently jam packed and while TJs may pull some of that business, it might also just grow the grocery business for both.

I think a median on 63rd and a mid-block crossing are eminently doable. Depending on how the land where the old Varsity stood is developed, there could even be on-street parking developed there, which would be a traffic calmer. There is no reason traffic has to go 45 mph on that one block stretch.

I'm not worried about the parking situation...check out the Trader Joe's in Fort Worth. It's a very small parking lot and works just fine.

I really hope they have an attached liquor store. I need to try this 2 buck chuck everyone is harping about.

To comply with our liquor laws, the license would have to be obtained by a single individual who's a 10 year resident of the state. An even more interesting twist is that any TJ private label wines or spirits would have to go through the Oklahoma wholesale system and would then be available for any liquor store in the state to sell.

To comply with our liquor laws, the license would have to be obtained by a single individual who's a 10 year resident of the state. An even more interesting twist is that any TJ private label wines or spirits would have to go through the Oklahoma wholesale system and would then be available for any liquor store in the state to sell.

Not if the entire allocation were bought up immediately.

Not if the entire allocation were bought up immediately.

Much easier said than done considering that if it's allocated, every wholesaler including Sterling would be entitled to their equal share of the allocation... No one wholesaler can have an exclusive agreement to carry a product...

City Hall Blog: Bet on it: Trader Joe's is coming to town - Tulsa World: City Hall: Kevin Canfield And Jarrel Wade (http://www.tulsaworld.com/blogs/news/cityhall/city-hall-blog-bet-on-it-trader-joe-s-is/article_f9e15e08-5119-5eba-b951-6692275efa9d.html)

City Hall Blog: Bet on it: Trader Joe's is coming to town - Tulsa World: City Hall: Kevin Canfield And Jarrel Wade (http://www.tulsaworld.com/blogs/news/cityhall/city-hall-blog-bet-on-it-trader-joe-s-is/article_f9e15e08-5119-5eba-b951-6692275efa9d.html)

Interesting that the "Store Layout"/Site Plan says "WINE: YES".
I wonder if that was just an error.

City Hall Blog: Bet on it: Trader Joe's is coming to town - Tulsa World: City Hall: Kevin Canfield And Jarrel Wade (http://www.tulsaworld.com/blogs/news/cityhall/city-hall-blog-bet-on-it-trader-joe-s-is/article_f9e15e08-5119-5eba-b951-6692275efa9d.html)

Right by Tulsa's original Whole Foods. Interesting they are going right by WFs in each city. I assume it is because people will travel from all over for WFs, so TJs thinks they can get some ruboff. I am sure the ruboff will go both ways.

Right by Tulsa's original Whole Foods. Interesting they are going right by WFs in each city. I assume it is because people will travel from all over for WFs, so TJs thinks they can get some ruboff. I am sure the ruboff will go both ways.

I think it has to do with numbers on a spreadsheet. Though Trader Joe's targets a different shopper than Whole Foods does, judging off their locations it would appear that they like to be in areas with similar demographics.

Also, and we've discussed this before, in my work representing retail tenants many trust the research and success of others in their marketplace.

For example, I represented Burger King and they told me, "Get us a spot next to any McDoland's. We can pull their numbers and know we'll do about 75% of that business."

Same with Walgreens / CVS, Home Depot / Lowes, etc. Although I regard Whole Foods as very different as TJ's, they do go after the same sort of consumer and demographics.

All of these retailers operate with competitors everywhere, and they've learned which ones do their homework and which ones are successful in the same trade areas.

BTW, the reason the TJ's deal for Nichols Hills Plaza hasn't been completely finalized is they are working on some parking issues.

If you look at an aerial, there isn't a great deal of parking directly adjacent to the old Crescent space, and Pops will be going into 5,500 SF directly west (roughly the old NH Drug Store space).

They are planning to put more parking in the southwest corner, in the grassy area by CK & Co. and where Provision Kitchen is going in. But that's a long way from the TJ's space.

Before they sold the plaza, Chesapeake completely reworked the parking lot in the southern section, along with renovating the buildings. I wouldn't be surprised if Glimcher decided to rework it again because that TJ's is going to be overrun and it's going to be a serious issue for any other tenants in that shopping center.

I'm sure they'll find a way to make it work. But not sure Pops will start until TJ's does.

I'll have more on this soon.

I think saying it is numbers on a spreadsheet is way oversimplifying. I am sure WF's and TJ's target markets share a number of common demographics....education levels achieved, age, income level, etc. Data regarding that has to be available to them. Then, there has to be a sufficient number meeting those demographics within the normal shopping area (different for different kinds of areas...walking, driving, mass trans, etc. affects the area to draw from). Then, there has to be an indication that those targeted will respond at a minimum or preferred rate. Cost of achieving that penetration is also part of the equation. Then, cost of real estate has to be favorable, along with labor rates, utilities rates, etc.

If a WF is in an area and is successful, I am sure that TJ can make certain quick assumptions about demographics, etc. which by itself may not be the complete analysis but certainly reduces the risk. Even though their shoppers may be different, the demographics pool is shared. WF will get theirs and TJ will get theirs. But they still must make the other numbers work out. And, since they don't have the same logistics, their cost of business or barriers may be different so one might be successful and one might not, even if the market is sufficient. A better lease may mitigate the fact that their cost of product sourcing is higher. Or, a better location with higher traffic may be a factor.

All in all, these organizations don't do things off emotion, but usually after careful analysis. That is generally why they succeed and those that are more emotional tend to fail at a higher rate. Having consulted with any number of retailers and other businesses, I tend to see those that don't do their research up front and to properly analyze the risk, fail more often than not.

Saw this get retweeted by the Chisholm creek group https://twitter.com/tulsaworld/status/573579560064839682
but it confirms what has already been known and can only mean good things for our OKC Trader Joes.