Just saw that the Frontier name will remain and Republic Airlines will become Frontier. The animal-theme will also remain.

So the new airline will keep the name Frontier. Not unexpected and a good solid choice. The animal tails stay but the Midwest fresh chocolate chip cookies go to every flight!

Frontier and Midwest Airlines - We Are 1 (http://frontiermidwest.com/WeAre1/home/)

Operations integrated by Nov 2010 and Midwest brand totally gone by Oct 2011.

Route Map where we can start guessing where to play connect the dots: http://www.frontiermidwest.com/weare1/mediakit/Midwest-Frontier-Routemap.html

0yDwHgyO3ek

Q. What about the Midwest Airlines cookie?
A. Cookie lovers can breathe a sigh of relief because the chocolate chip cookie isn’t going anywhere. We are currently working to determine the best way to introduce the cookie on all of our flights (without Griz eating them all!). Until then, you’ll still enjoy a freshly-baked chocolate chip cookie on our Embraer fleet and we’ll continue to provide updates as we work to introduce them across our entire Airbus fleet.

Q. Will all the planes be painted with animals on the tail?
A. Of course! The animals on our tail celebrate our vision of being different. Eventually, each plane across our fleet will be painted in Frontier livery with a unique animal on every tail. This isn’t something we can do overnight, but we will gradually convert the livery over the next 12 - 18 months and will provide you with updates on our additions.

Q. What animals will you be adding to the tails?
A. Much of that is yet to be decided, however, we are introducing our first new animal at the end of April. Our newest member of the Frontier “spokesanimal” family will be a badger, who will proudly represent the history of Midwest and our dedication to our second largest hub, Milwaukee. (The badger is the state animal of Wisconsin.)

Q. What is his or her name?
A. Our badger has not been named yet. We’re turning to the great Wisconsin community to help name our newest addition. Details of where and when to submit name suggestions will be announced in the coming weeks.

Q. What are your plans for in-flight entertainment? Will you keep the TVs?
A. The TVs installed in our Airbus fleet will stay. We are still exploring other in-flight entertainment options and plan to have some form available in each of our aircraft by 2011.

Like the new commercial....

Since Lynx is going bye-bye, our Frontier flights to Denver will be served by Embraer 170/175/190's for the time being.

It would be nice to see OKC-Kansas City and Milwaukee on the new Frontier. Any possibility of OKC being a focus city someday? Not a hub like Denver, KC, or Milwaukee but similar to Omaha. Tulsa-Kansas City would be a good addition as well.

Kansas City would be a blood bath with Southwest. So that won't happen. Milwaukee I would say we'll see it in the Fall or early next year. Possibly the return of Florida as well.

Kansas City would be a blood bath with Southwest. So that won't happen. Milwaukee I would say we'll see it in the Fall or early next year. Possibly the return of Florida as well.

I didn't realize Southwest still flew the OKC-KC route, do they fly TUL-KC as well?

Last time I checked they do.

I didn't realize Southwest still flew the OKC-KC route, do they fly TUL-KC as well?

No they don't fly TUL-MCI

I stand corrected. I was thinking of St. Louis, they have managed to hold on to that flight.

I didn't realize Southwest still flew the OKC-KC route, do they fly TUL-KC as well?

Twice daily on OKC-MCI (Kansas City). Down from the 4-5 they use to do.

Quick compare of Southwest in OKC and Tulsa since it has been awhile...this is the May schedule.

Oklahoma City - 20x daily
BWI (Baltimore) - 1x daily
DAL (Dallas Love) - 5x daily
DEN (Denver) - 3x daily
HOU (Houston Hobby) - 4x daily
MCI (Kansas City - 2x daily
LAS (Las Vegas) - 1x daily
PHX (Phoenix) - 2x daily
STL (St Louis) - 2x daily

Tulsa - 18x daily
DAL - 6x daily
DEN - 3x daily
HOU - 4x daily
LAS - 1x daily
PHX - 2x daily
STL - 2x daily

Hey guys, anybody notice this report on cnnmoney about united/usair that WAS NEARLY ALL VIDEO SHOTS OF OKC AIRPORT??? Cool Cool.

http://money.cnn.com/video/markets/2010/04/08/mkts_us_airways_united_airlines_merger.cnnmoney/

Hah. Good catch.

Even though I think this merger is DOA by the DOJ for the 3rd time. Of course I may be partial. :-P

Alaska Air is supposed to make a major announcement today. Doubt it has anything to do with OKC but you never know. Besides, this thread needs to be revived a little bit.

The website is coming along nicely for those interested.

My parents came to visit us in Tampa and used the OKC-TPA seasonal nonstop from Frontier. They said it was full both ways. I really hope that nonstop becomes more than a seasonal thing. Very convenient. :)

It already ended. It might get picked up again this fall/winter.

The Southwest plane was Florida One.

Southwest will add a 3rd daily flight to Denver starting in March. The attack on Frontier is starting...but it is good to know, OKC is one of Frontier's stronger cities.

I just wish we qualified for their larger planes. To me, that's the major attraction of SW over them.

The E190 and E170 is a respectable airplane. Lynx Q400 Dash 8 service ended on the 18th of this month and was replaced with E190 and E170 aircraft.

Photos: Embraer ERJ-190-100IGW 190AR Aircraft Pictures | Airliners.net (http://www.airliners.net/photo/Midwest-Connect-(Republic/Embraer-ERJ-190-100IGW-190AR/1648581/L/)

That's one I got arriving from Tampa a few months ago.

The E190 is set to get GoGo Inflight Wifi by the end of this year, as a part of the new Frontier service integration plan.

Oh, they aren't bad - better than the prop jobs which were acceptible. It's more a perception/pride issue that an NBA level city can't qualify for full size jets. Plus, flying through storms or landing in Denver's ever-present turbulence can be an adventure in the smaller planes.

I agree with the perception issue. It makes me mad when everyone around town are saying we are a major city and etc.. I'm an optimistic person, but people from out of town who fly in sure are disappointed. Can't find anything but a Regional Jet, or if they are lucky might get a mainline. 25 or 30 minutes can go by without seeing one plane move at OKC.

Had a friend from New York come into town a few days ago. He doesn't even see why we need jetways since all of our planes have stairs built into them, except for Southwest. He was being tongue in cheek though, but the point is valid. What is world class and HUGE MAJOR CITY about us? Is it just the NBA? Is it just our MAPS3 program?

I think it is in our minds -- I agree that we are on the way to becoming a "major city", but I don't think we can pat ourselves on the back just yet - we have a way to go.

<-Off my soapbox.

OKC doesn't need to be NYC in order to be a major city. It almost seems like people coming into OKC are expecting it to be the same as Chicago or Dallas or something.

I think that is what many people from out of town fail to realize. And this is what bugs me.

OKC is a major city, because it has 1.3 million people in it's metro area. OKC offers big city amenities and attractions and holds its own weight with cities larger, but also could take improvement lessons from much smaller cities.

That is why I, and many others, frequent this board; because we want OKC to continue to improve. I, for one, am glad that so many people are now taking pride in OKC as a major city.

Also, doesn't United fly all mainliners from Denver? Doesn't AA do mainliners from Dallas?

I would say the fact that OKC has so many RJ's is more due to the change in the industry than it is OKC not be 'major city enough' to have mainliners. Those industry changes included 1) people wanted more frequent flights and 2) people wanted service to markets that really couldn't support a mainline flight on their own most days.

United Airlines flies almost ALL regional jet service from LAX (domestically). Does that make LAX a po-dunk airport? There are many other large cities around the nation with mostly regional jets also - again, it's mostly a sign of the industry.

OKC has more pax now than it ever has (generally speaking) and if you look back in the past, OKC had way more mainliners but quite a bit less flight options/cities.

Those major cities with tons of regional jets have RJ's because they are hubs. Take Atlanta for example, they are a hub, with hundreds of RJ's. Hubs feed off of all the cities like ours.

Look at Austin, look at San Antonio, look at Jacksonville, look at Nashville, etc. They have no problem filling seats, having a lot of flights per day, and having a ton of mainline service.

We have 73 flights a day. And about 12 of them are mainline.

Austin has about 150 flights a day, and a majority of them are mainline.

Also, don't miss my point. I am not basing a city's "major" status by the air service. I am basing the air service on the "major" status. As far as the airline industry is going, we aren't really that much ahead of Tulsa and we are trailing far behind Omaha.

how could that be, 12 mainline flights?

United does 5 flights a day to Denver, aren't they all A319 or A320? AA does 2 flights mainline a day to DFW, right. Southwest does 12 flights a day, mainline. Doesn't CO still have 2 mainlines to IAH?

Im not buyin the hub airport argument that you said. OKC has regional jets because the city wanted more frequent service and wanted access to the coasts.

Im sure United could replace those two regional jets from LAX and have one mainline A319 flight or perhaps a mostly full 757. But folks want selection, and right now - LAX couldn't support two mainline flights so RJ works best. Same for DL in ATL.

We could have one flight full as mainline or two flights full as RJ. ... Seems to be an industry trend and not exclusive to OKC.

If people weren't so comfortable driving down to DFW to catch flights, Im sure OKC's numbers might be a bit higher than they are. Speaking of that - MKE once had the same problem with ORD, but now market themselves to Northern Chicago suburbs as the Chicagoland region's 3rd airport. They are having extreme success - as Midwest/Frontier would certainly have much lower numbers without the support from the Chicago juggernaut propping it up with folks driving up from the city.

Is this something Will Rogers should start doing a better job of? Could WRWA shoot for being a sort of 'reliever' airport for DFW, in the same way that MKE has successfully 'relieved' ORD and MDW?

Skywest, you said earlier "what is this world class and major city about us....."

no person ever said OKC was a major city because of it's flight schedule. OKC is a major city because of it's population, and political and (to a lesser extent) economic strengths.

Southwest is mainline no matter what so I don't include that in my figures, if you want to count Southwest, we have about 30 mainline flight a day. United has 1x to Denver that is mainline, American has 5 to 6x to Dallas that are mainline, Continental has 1x to Houston that is mainline. Delta and Frontier are 100% contracted out regionals.

Those cities above have virtually no problem supporting mainline to just about anywhere they put it on it.

Skywest, you said earlier "what is this world class and major city about us....."

no person ever said OKC was a major city because of it's flight schedule. OKC is a major city because of it's population, and political and (to a lesser extent) economic strengths.

What is world class about 1.3 million people, it's politics, and 2 large oil companies?

I am playing devil's advocate here - I want everyone to know that. I do love this city and am very proud of it. How do we convince others we are this stunning great city we say we are?

What is world class about 1.3 million people, it's politics, and 2 large oil companies?

I am playing devil's advocate here - I want everyone to know that. I do love this city and am very proud of it. How do we convince others we are this stunning great city we say we are?

^^ Major city,Yes-in America! World Class? not even close! NO!

...Those cities above have virtually no problem supporting mainline to just about anywhere they put it on it.

I suspect passenger count drives the issue of regional jet v. mainline. You cited Austin as having lots of mainliners. Well, their passenger count is more than twice ours. To me, that answers that.

Now your other example, Omaha, I don't know about. Do you know their passenger count number and the number of mainliners they have v. regionals? It would be surprising if those numbers didn't correspond.

PS - thanks for the insight you provide here.

Give me about an hour to do some research for Omaha and I will get some detailed stats for you.

I can only search schedules for the future, I will choose the week of May 9th for both OKC and Omaha stats.
UA= United Airlines and regional
AA=American Airlines and regional
CO=Continental and regional
DL=Delta and regionals
F9=Frontier and regionals
WN=Southwest Airlines
FL=AirTran Airways (operated by SkyWest Airlines)
YX=Midwest (now Frontier)
US=US Airways and regionals

OMAHA:
AIRLINE = CITY (MAINLINE VS. RGNL.)
UA=DEN (5X MAINLINE 1X RGNL), ORD (5X MAINLINE 2X RGNL)
AA=DFW (5X 0X) ORD (0X 5X)
CO=IAH (1X 5X) EWR (0X 2X)
DL=ATL (0X 4X) SLC (0X 3X) MSP (1X 5X) DTW (0X 3X) CVG (0X 1X) MEM (0X 3X)
F9=DEN (0X 5X) MKE (0X 4X) DCA (0X 1X) MCO (0X 0X SEASONAL)
WN=LAS (3X 0X) PHX (2X 0X) DEN (3X 0X) MCO (0X 0X SAT SVC ONLY) STL (3X 0X) MDW (5X 0X)
FL=MKE (0X 2X)
YX=SEE F9
US=PHX (2X 1X)

->>>>>>>>>MAINLINE: 35 DEPS/ MINUS WN=19
->>>>>>>>>REGIONAL JET: 47 DEPS
->>>>>>>>>TOTAL: 82 DEPS
->>>>>>>>>PERCENT MAINLINE: 42%
->>>>>>>>>PERCENT REGIONAL JET: 58%
->>>>>>>>>N/S DESTINATIONS: 19
->>>>>>>>>PAX/YR (2009): 4.2M

OKC:
UA=DEN (2X MAINLINE 3X RGNL), ORD (0X MAINLINE 5X RGNL) IAD (0X 1X) LAX (0X 2X)
AA=DFW (7X 0X) ORD (0X 5X)
CO=IAH (1X 8X) EWR (0X 1X)
DL=ATL (0X 5X) SLC (0X 3X) MSP (0X 3X) DTW (0X 3X) MEM (0X 3X)
F9=DEN (0X 4X)
WN=LAS (1X 0X) PHX (2X 0X) DEN (2X 0X) STL (2X 0X) MCI (2X 0X) BWI (1X 0X) DAL (4X 0X) HOU (4X 0X)
FL=0X
YX=0X
US=0X

->>>>>>>>>MAINLINE: 28 DEPS MINUS WN=10
->>>>>>>>>REGIONAL JET: 46 DEPS
->>>>>>>>>TOTAL: 74 DEPS
->>>>>>>>>PERCENT MAINLINE: 37%
->>>>>>>>>PERCENT REGIONAL JET: 62%
->>>>>>>>>N/S DESTINATIONS: 19
->>>>>>>>>PAX/YR (2009): 3.3M

That's some good info/data. Thanks.

Wow. I'm really surprised about Omaha's passenger counts. That's almost a million more than Will Rogers. Their 2008 metro population numbers are around 850,000, well below our 1.2 mil.

Obviously their population takes to the skies more than people here. Another tidbit of info that shows we need to grow our business sector (finance, technology, banking). If we're successful with building businesses such as this, those employees require travel - ergo, more flights and more mainline planes.

Also, glad to see your earlier line about the website coming along. I was at the airport several weeks ago on a 'tour' and asked about it. Was told they knew the current site is bad and they're working on the new one....spending time with the company they hired to create it.

Hope it comes online soon.

Oh, no, my personal website devoted to the OKC Airport. Not the flyokc.com one.

Oh, no, my personal website devoted to the OKC Airport. Not the flyokc.com one.

Aww man! ugh. lol. And here I was, holding out hope......

Yeah, not working out there means no insider info for me.... Except for my back-room "interview" with the Secret Service the other day....I didn't know a foreign dignitary was on that plane lol!

That's some good info/data. Thanks.

Wow. I'm really surprised about Omaha's passenger counts. That's almost a million more than Will Rogers. Their 2008 metro population numbers are around 850,000, well below our 1.2 mil.

Obviously their population takes to the skies more than people here. Another tidbit of info that shows we need to grow our business sector (finance, technology, banking). If we're successful with building businesses such as this, those employees require travel - ergo, more flights and more mainline planes.

^^ Lincoln is just SW from Omaha and has 250,000 people as well!Also Omaha's bigger numbers might be because it is the only "major" airport around? because I think you guys are forgetting that TUL is a stones throw away!and also forgetting That The powerehouse known as DFW is just South!I dont know- just throwing this out there!

That's some good info/data. Thanks.

Wow. I'm really surprised about Omaha's passenger counts. That's almost a million more than Will Rogers. Their 2008 metro population numbers are around 850,000, well below our 1.2 mil.

Obviously their population takes to the skies more than people here. Another tidbit of info that shows we need to grow our business sector (finance, technology, banking). If we're successful with building businesses such as this, those employees require travel - ergo, more flights and more mainline planes.

Omaha is a smaller city than OKC but has a larger number of corporate offices than OKC. More corporate executives = more business traveling.
Here's an article that outlines that fact:

USATODAY.com - Omaha sprouts unlikely cash crop: Corporate titans (http://www.usatoday.com/money/companies/2005-08-07-omaha-usat_x.htm)

People that want more air service either through more destinations, flights, or larger planes always seem to forget the corporate requirement. To get those things you need high yielding traffic. People will to pay to fill up the front of the cabins, when they are available, or the higher priced tickets. The more bargain chasing a community does the faster they will see service levels drop. As stated...Omaha has a larger corporate setting than OKC, hence more service. Austin has a much larger corporate base and higher paying jobs, hence more service.

Until we see OKC attracting companies that are going to high hundreds of people paying $35-50k a year at least, not much is going to happen.

Oh, they aren't bad - better than the prop jobs which were acceptible. It's more a perception/pride issue that an NBA level city can't qualify for full size jets. Plus, flying through storms or landing in Denver's ever-present turbulence can be an adventure in the smaller planes.

Unless someone wants a first class section, I've never seen the big attraction for the larger jets. I've always enjoyed flying in commuter jets. They load and unload very fast making connections much easier if you're in the back of the plane. If you're checking in luggage, it's more likely that the luggage will make a connecting flight. The main drawback would be the smaller overhead bins. I feel just as safe in the smaller jets and I've never experienced any major turbulence problems even though I know that could happen.

Unless someone wants a first class section, I've never seen the big attraction for the larger jets. I've always enjoyed flying in commuter jets. They load and unload very fast making connections much easier if you're in the back of the plane. If you're checking in luggage, it's more likely that the luggage will make a connecting flight. The main drawback would be the smaller overhead bins. I feel just as safe in the smaller jets and I've never experienced any major turbulence problems even though I know that could happen.

People really need to get over the the phobia from RJs and props. Most props seat between 30 and 72 seats now. They offer pretty decent comfort (Dash 8s particularly), speed close to that of the RJs, and the operating costs are significantly less. As far as RJs...what is an RJ really. We've had "mainline" jets before that didn't seat over 80 people...Fokker 28 and DC-9-10. The Embraer E-Jet series is seating 70-110 people now. The new Bombardier C-Series will be 80-130 seats. The lines are so blurred now, people should just be happy with the level of air service they receive. There are dozens of other cities that would love to take it away if we don't want to use it.

People really need to get over the the phobia from RJs and props. Most props seat between 30 and 72 seats now. They offer pretty decent comfort (Dash 8s particularly), speed close to that of the RJs, and the operating costs are significantly less. As far as RJs...what is an RJ really. We've had "mainline" jets before that didn't seat over 80 people...Fokker 28 and DC-9-10. The Embraer E-Jet series is seating 70-110 people now. The new Bombardier C-Series will be 80-130 seats. The lines are so blurred now, people should just be happy with the level of air service they receive. There are dozens of other cities that would love to take it away if we don't want to use it.

I agree. I have customers who totally freak out if they aren't booked on a large jet. I don't argue with them because it's pointless. Making the customer happy comes first.

OKC has 1.3 million now, not 1.2.

But I do agree, OKC has MUCH more competition than OMAHA - which severely hurts OKC's pax numbers. but if I recall correct, OKC had 4million pax a year prior to the economic slowdown (not sure what year that was); but just saying - our population alone generally keeps OKC in play.

If we added corporate base and people stop driving to DFW - I think it would be even larger. Also don't forget - we have a train that goes down daily to one of OKC's business market cities (only 4 hours); so that eats a few potential butts in the aircraft seats.

But I think the biggest reason for OKC's rather smaller traffic is 1) DFW, only 200 miles away 2) competition from TUL and ICT, they usually have lower air fares except to the pacific coast (OKC has the advantage there) 3) Corporate base

How Omaha compares to OKC's handicaps:

Omaha doesn't have a top 5 international (US) airport 200 miles from it. The closest is Chicago O'Hare, at least 400 miles away; MCI is close but isn't a top international airport and really doesn't offer much more than OMA does (so there's no reason for business people to drive the short distance (unlike OKC/DFW). ..

Omaha doesn't have regional competition either AND Omaha has a larger catchment area (as in All of NE, W. IA, and parts of NE KS).

Omaha has a slightly larger corporate base - actually, but this base that Omaha has is FINANCIAL; OKC's base is Energy. This means OMA flights are required to go to Chicago (MKE is only 70 miles away from downtown Chicago). Notice how many non-stop flights OMA has to Chicago - definitely their largest market city and given the frequencies of flights, you know those are 'suits' on those planes and not as many families. ...

No doubt, without these flights - OMA would lose those finance jobs. DSM similar, just Insurance for them.

Also notice OKC's flight selection: we have more markets/coastal presence. OMA just has 1 flight to the DC area, but OKC has at least 2 (IAD and BWI). OMA has no LAX flight, whereas OKC has 2 dailies.

So I conclude from this: Omaha has bigger numbers despite OKC being 53% larger due to 1) no large scale competition, 2) Corporate base that requires frequent flights 3) it doesn't have any regional competitors (and no in-state competition).

If we can increase our corporate presence in Finance (doesn't need to be a hq, just need more jobs in the financial sector), encourage existing business/leisure customers to use OKC instead of driving to DFW, and somehow establish a lower price point than competing regional cities - then OKC would be able to enjoy much larger numbers than OMA.

I dont see TUL or ICT going away (but I do see them remaining smaller than OKC), so our opportunites are increasing corporate/business that requires travel AND encouraging existing corporate base and leisure to use WRWA.

People that live in the OKC metro aren't flocking in mass numbers to DFW, TUL, ICT, or AMA. However, if you live southern OK, why wouldn't you go to DFW? You can fly non stop to just about anywhere from there. Unless you are flying to a hub, you can't do that in OKC. I just don't see this changing, well, ever.

As far as regional jets are concerned, I guess I've gotten used to them. There are a few a I try to avoid like the plague.(The devil's chariot...CRJ-200/700 come to mind) To me, there's not really much of a stigma associated with RJ's anymore. You see RJ's going to major cities all the time. Last year, I flew almost 200,000 butt in the seat miles, all domestic or Canada, and almost 70% of my flights were on RJ's.

It's been said before, but it's worth repeating. To get mainliners, you are going to give up frequency. The airlines are not going to fly half empty planes. Airlines have been cutting capacity across the board, and the trend is going to continue at least until the Delta merger and the probable Continental/United merger get ironed out.

By the way, flew in/out of IND this week. This was my second trip through there since they've opened the new airport. I'm still impressed. Wow! What a facility.

My favorite airline was Jet express because of their use of small jets. Too bad they were only in the market for a short time.

You had to go outside to enter but they loaded everyone fast and unloaded fast. Plus it allowed the line to fly direct to the markets it was serving instead of having to stop somewhere on the way. So the flights were all direct flights. Was able to fly to Calif. via jet express to meet up with a friend whom was flying a different airline. He had to be the the airport 2 hours ahead of me and landed 1 hour after I had arrived.

My favorite airline was Jet express because of their use of small jets. Too bad they were only in the market for a short time.

You had to go outside to enter but they loaded everyone fast and unloaded fast. Plus it allowed the line to fly direct to the markets it was serving instead of having to stop somewhere on the way. So the flights were all direct flights. Was able to fly to Calif. via jet express to meet up with a friend whom was flying a different airline. He had to be the the airport 2 hours ahead of me and landed 1 hour after I had arrived.

Express Jet, whom you are referring too, couldn't make any money with that branded operation so yeah...unfortunately they got rid of it. It definitely helped to get some service into cities that didn't exist before, but the market wouldn't let them charge the fares needed to make money. They are still the primary feeder for Continental and have recently put 20 aircraft in the United Express program.

OKC has 1.3 million now, not 1.2.

But I do agree, OKC has MUCH more competition than OMAHA - which severely hurts OKC's pax numbers. but if I recall correct, OKC had 4million pax a year prior to the economic slowdown (not sure what year that was); but just saying - our population alone generally keeps OKC in play.

If we added corporate base and people stop driving to DFW - I think it would be even larger. Also don't forget - we have a train that goes down daily to one of OKC's business market cities (only 4 hours); so that eats a few potential butts in the aircraft seats.

But I think the biggest reason for OKC's rather smaller traffic is 1) DFW, only 200 miles away 2) competition from TUL and ICT, they usually have lower air fares except to the pacific coast (OKC has the advantage there) 3) Corporate base

So I conclude from this: Omaha has bigger numbers despite OKC being 53% larger due to 1) no large scale competition, 2) Corporate base that requires frequent flights 3) it doesn't have any regional competitors (and no in-state competition).

I dont see TUL or ICT going away (but I do see them remaining smaller than OKC), so our opportunites are increasing corporate/business that requires travel AND encouraging existing corporate base and leisure to use WRWA.

I trimmed your post a bit in my response. Couple points.

Here are the stats for OKC over the last 10 years:
RITA | BTS | Transtats (http://www.transtats.bts.gov/airports.asp?pn=1&Airport=OKC&Airport_Name=Oklahoma%20City,%20OK:%20Will%20Roger s%20World&carrier=FACTS)

We never hit the 4 mil passenger mark yet. So still some work to go.

OMA definitely has an advantage not having to compete with a major regional airport nearby. I don't really think they get all of NE because that would be an insane drive for the far western section. Those areas are more than likely handled by EAS service on Great Lakes to Denver. As far as OKC goes. I think TUL and ICT definitely play a factor. For the people who are in Stroud or further east probably chose Tulsa...maybe even as far as Chandler. Either way, they will look at price and then also how long it takes them to get to the airport. ICT is a different animal as they attract people with Allegiant and AirTran with the low cost service. If OKC could get Allegiant back and secure AirTran, it would be a non-issue.

I really think the amount of draw to DFW is a bit over done. This isn't a major situation where we have a setup like those areas in the Midwest with the major hubs close to other medium sized cities. In those areas, the medium cities have well below average air service due to having a 50-90% leakage rate of their passengers. Here, I would guess OKC looses around 10% to surround airports with DFW having the smaller piece of pie.

Essentially...OKC will get more air service when the market can support it. Either through paying higher ticket prices or the corporate population growing.

SkyWest Airlines (the regional operator for United and Delta) is currently nearing (or at) full fleet utilization.

We will not see United increase our LAX service or add San Francisco until SkyWest aquires more CRJ-700's for United Express. Any increase in capacity will be forced to go to mainline, or the aircraft will be pulled from existing markets and added to those that will fill it.

I think our 2x daily CRJ-700 at LAX will stay like it is. The possibility of getting SFO is rather slim right now even though the market could support it, just like it has LAX. United doesn't want to contract another regional to go into one of SkyWest's biggest "hubs" (SFO, LAX). Keeping your contractors happy will keep you happy.

I don't think Allegiant would be too far fetched. They do maintenance here now, they have been in the market before, and they serve a unique niche.

AirTran is still a ways off in my opinion - but not in left field. As venture and I have said for a while now...seats are meant to be filled, when they can be filled, we'll get more of them.

I think a lot of the DFW/DAL leakage is over as well. We have 11 daily departures to DFW and DAL - mainline. That is roughly 1,485 seats each way.

OKC has 1.3 million now, not 1.2.

Depends on where you "draw the line," as you like to put it. MSA = 1.2 million. CSA = 1.3 million.


Omaha has bigger numbers despite OKC being 53% larger

Since we're fact-checking here--evidently you used OKC's CSA number but Omaha's MSA number in your calculation:

(1297552-849517)/849517 = 0.527 = 53%

(Omaha's 2009 CSA estimate was 885,157, not 849,517.)

It's more correct to use one of the following percentages:

CSA: (1297552-885157)/885157 = 0.466 = 47%
MSA: (1227278-849517)/849517 = 0.444 = 44%
City: (551789-438646)/438646 = 0.258 = 26%

Semi, I thought Del Camino was using OMA CSA at 850K while using OKC at 1.2M. People on here seem to often use other city's CSA but then chock up 1.2M for OKC.

I think we should use CSA and be consistent.

As for my original argument, I haven't yet seen any comments/evidence to the counter and Venture/Chris summarized it eloquently as well:

OKC has lower service not because it is small but instead because 1) the desire of frequency and 2) the desire for coastal markets.

We get rj's not because OKC is a podunk town but because 1) we have an energy dominant economy (hence mainliners to other energy cities), rj's frequently to finance cities 2) OKC has a top 5 US international airport only 200 miles away (sorry Venture, I've read there is significant leakage on many posts about people going to Dallas for shopping and flights, not to mention the train; I suspect it may be more than 10%) 3) OKC has competition in smaller regional cities (that often offer lower fares to the Eastern US).

Venture, thanks for the correction on the 4M pax number - I thought we had exceeded that finally and there was some big press announcement about it (along with the plethora of non-stop cities served) before the industry collapsed and OKC's flight capacity was drastically reduced.

Semi, you could just make it easy (like I did) and just divide OKC's CSA by OMA's CSA (then remove the 1). Nevertheless, OMA is impressive - kudos to their finance industry.

Semi, I thought Del Camino was using OMA CSA at 850K while using OKC at 1.2M. People on here seem to often use other city's CSA but then chock up 1.2M for OKC.

I think we should use CSA and be consistent.

As for my original argument, I haven't yet seen any comments/evidence to the counter and Venture/Chris summarized it eloquently as well:

OKC has lower service not because it is small but instead because 1) the desire of frequency and 2) the desire for coastal markets.

We get rj's not because OKC is a podunk town but because 1) we have an energy dominant economy (hence mainliners to other energy cities), rj's frequently to finance cities 2) OKC has a top 5 US international airport only 200 miles away (sorry Venture, I've read there is significant leakage on many posts about people going to Dallas for shopping and flights, not to mention the train; I suspect it may be more than 10%) 3) OKC has competition in smaller regional cities (that often offer lower fares to the Eastern US).

Venture, thanks for the correction on the 4M pax number - I thought we had exceeded that finally and there was some big press announcement about it (along with the plethora of non-stop cities served) before the industry collapsed and OKC's flight capacity was drastically reduced.

Semi, you could just make it easy (like I did) and just divide OKC's CSA by OMA's CSA (then remove the 1). Nevertheless, OMA is impressive - kudos to their finance industry.

As someone else pointed out earlier, when looking at airport traffic, you really need to also include the population of the Lincoln metropolitan area (300,000), giving the Omaha/Lincoln area a total of close to 1.2 million, not far short of OKC's population. Combined with some of the other factors mentioned above (primarily the fact that Omaha has FAR fewer competing airports within 200 miles) pretty easily explains Omaha's air traffic.

It might be useful to compare OKC to some airports in a few other similarly-sized metro areas. Here are a few I looked up:

Louisville, KY: 2009: 3.2 million passengers
Richmond, VA: 2009: 3.3 million passengers
Rochester, NY: 2009: 2.6 million

if you can add Lincoln to Omaha, I think it is only fair to add most/all of Western Oklahoma to OKC. ...

but I see your point nonetheless.

Airport Trust Meeting Agenda Documents released today for tomorrow morning's meeting.

I found this interesting, it's the Strategic Land Development Plan. It coincides with the Master Plan, but it's focus is on the east side of the airport only.

http://okc.gov/AgendaPub/cache/2/r40ota45rj33n555wgogil45/87723504272010012855966.PDF

Calls for Portland Ave to be relocated to the east and be made a spine road. Very interesting maps and information in there, it's a long read like all plans are. Maps are near the middle of the document. It's focus is mainly on general aviation (corporate, small aircraft, etc.), air cargo, indirect aviation, and non-aeronautical uses (nothing to do with aviation, but on airport property - located where it is impossible to make it aviation related development)

http://okc.gov/AgendaPub/view.aspx?cabinet=PUBLISHED_MEETINGS&fileid=877235

Link won't work, try the above.

Double post - delete.

people in western OK can drive to Lawton. I believe they have 6 flights a day to DFW on American.

or Amarillo

People from the majority of western Oklahoma use Will Rogers for their airport. Lawton may work for the immediate area, and if you want to go thru DFW, but most other markets there (Enid, Woodward, Clinton, Weatherford, etc) all use OKC.

And probably, so do, east central residents such as Ada, McAlester and Seminole.

But....those places still don't add much to the idea of more flying seats for business travel.

If Lawton is going to be counted against Will Rogers' market, then Lincoln, NE can't be included in Omaha's market as some have done in above posts. They have their own airport, serviced by Delta and United.

AA at Lawton is very insignifigant. 420 seats a day each way.

how many seats is offered from Lincoln?