I decided to call today. After asking about the alleged map and alleged web site update, the lady put me on hold for a few minutes. She returned saying that the new web site and system map would be up in August.

We shall see...

I believe we need a REAL public transit system, this does not mean a mono rail-thats a "tourist attraction", I believe expanding the coverage and times of operation of the public transit, for example replacing the buses we have now with a hydrogen fueled fleet, with accompanying "spare parts and personnel",
We used the phrase "Capital of the 21st Century", lets show the country how its done, lets be on the cutting edge, not just in Oklahoma, but the Nation.
I believe we can make the Metro, divided into Zones a realistic, useful, timely way to get around on the system we could divided the City into 3 zones, 1. zone Reno and Council -this one will run North and South -Council,Rockwell,Meridian, 2. Reno and Sooner or Sunnylane this one runs the Midwest City and Del City runs and Tinker AFB,3. the Downtown Terminal this one runs the East and West runs which may include Memorial to Council-
NW Expressway, NW/NE 23rd, then 29 SW/SE, 89th SW/SE and of course we need Downtown transit/trolleys . I propose we build the other 2 Zone "Terminals",substations, with buses running between the other substations periodically. Connected in a realistic grid and use manner,.
Now Of course, we should identify all the major employers, shopping and most importantly the Vo Tech Centers, so we can make realistic routes " if you remove the obstacles in learning a trade, or open new opportunities to widen our citizens' income base, we will grow stronger and the continued success. I welcome new residents, but we should also make every opportunity available in helping our citizens to a sucessful life, and the high quality of life I believe Oklahoma City does give , but it will become more within the reach of more residents, not just visitors.
Our only concern is the "we never done that before" mindset, or any Special Intrests.
Right now Oklahoma City is a relatively a young city, a city reaching for "adulthood", I believe a MAPS3, funded public transit system will show the rest of the Nation, we strive to be a "adult city", and by passing the "period of Adolescence", with the accompaning "what do I get out of it" intrests.
We need a genuine discussion, not "electability" issues or posturing for the press.
If I can be of any help I'm intrested.
I welcome other views, and maybe someone has a better plan, then this primer one.

I believe we need a REAL public transit system

If we could just go by a modified example of what the original OKC streetcar system was we could gain a very dense inner city population.

MTP obviously advocates strongly for the streetcar. We think that it is the most important component in the Fixed Guideway Study. The reason is that $100 million gets you an entirely functional and permanent system in three years. "Almost overnight" for a rail project. However, we must re-evaluate the bus system. The FGS shows how to create "cooridors" to the bus transfer center. The merits of our grid and reorganized routes following that grid and cannot be ignored in the near future. I will start posting real data as our group assimilates the info.

Am I missing something here?

From this week's OK Gazette Opinion page (http://www.okgazette.com/p/12738/a/4158/Default.aspx), my emphasis added:


...I worked for Rep. Ernest Istook for seven years; I have studied the pros and cons of light rail and mass transit for a long time. Light rail and mass transit systems are expensive, but I think it is about time we look at them under a brand new light.

When Atlanta originally put in their mass transit lines, called the Metropolitan Atlanta Rapid Transit Authority (MARTA), they tried basic routes, which were originally derided, but now it has grown as the city has grown, and their transit system is lauded by many.

If we are to put in mass transit and light rail, it needs to be funded by the people who use it and the municipalities that it incorporates into its system...

If we are to put in mass transit and light rail, it needs to be funded onlyby the people who use it...[/INDENT]

If that's what the opinion piece had said, I'd agree.

I am confused too. I can't really tell if the opinion piece is an endorsement or what. Regarding use, perhaps we should toll people for every road they drive on too. I mean, we subsidize that infrastructure- but the subsidy mechanism is hidden.

As promised, I will start posting data as it becomes available. Here is our first wave of data in PDF form for easy viewing.

It is charts showing the relative speeds of all 24 bus lines supported by MetroTransit.

MATHEMATICAL ANALYSIS OF BUS SPEEDS- "Thus, why car enabled people do not use the Metro Transit System"

The study was conducted by one of our advisory board members- Mr. Walter Jacques. He also noted the lack of a system map.

Regarding use, perhaps we should toll people for every road they drive on too. I mean, we subsidize that infrastructure- but the subsidy mechanism is hidden.

Agreed.

We would pay less in tolls on private highways than we currently pay in taxes.

Am I missing something here?

From this week's OK Gazette Opinion page (http://www.okgazette.com/p/12738/a/4158/Default.aspx), my emphasis added:


...I worked for Rep. Ernest Istook for seven years; I have studied the pros and cons of light rail and mass transit for a long time. Light rail and mass transit systems are expensive, but I think it is about time we look at them under a brand new light.

When Atlanta originally put in their mass transit lines, called the Metropolitan Atlanta Rapid Transit Authority (MARTA), they tried basic routes, which were originally derided, but now it has grown as the city has grown, and their transit system is lauded by many.

If we are to put in mass transit and light rail, it needs to be funded by the people who use it and the municipalities that it incorporates into its system...

Yeah, I read this guy's opinion piece in the Gazette, pretty hard to take this guy seriously and he obviously seems out of touch with the reality in OKC. I'm hoping someone will write a counter-opinion piece.

Interesting interview in the Oklahoman with Secretary of Transportation Ray Lahood.

http://www.newsok.com/qa-with-ray-lahood/article/3380166

SAM BOWMAN, MEG SALYER RECOGNIZES MTP EFFORTS AT COUNCIL TODAY

Calls for MTP to present to council comprehensive plan for streetcar and bus improvements.

"to see how quickly we can put some understanding together on council. This is a group of young professionals- all passionate, and it seems to me, well informed, on the issues of transit and transit development. All residents, these are not outsider experts trying to come in and persuade us like we so often hear. These are local folks that all have, seem to have a good solid grasp of Oklahoma City and where we might go in the next stage or the first stage of transit. I think what I heard in terms of approach, initial approach is very thoughtful and very logical....

what these guys have put together in my time with them, in which I would like to suggest that we bring forward in some sort of presentation to us; is essentially a start-up for a MAPS 3 or MAPS 4 or something down the road on how to get started on mass trans.. takes a basic streetcar system and integrates it with a enhanced, not just a an enhanced, but reorganized bus system that ties in with a downtown streetcar system... a comprehensive enough approach for us to pay attention to"-Sam Bowman

Extended comments and specifics start at 1:47 on the City Council minute video link file at

City of Oklahoma City | City Council Archive (http://okc.gov/council/council_library/forms/CouncilMeetings.aspx?MeetingID=216)


See also comments from Pete White and Meg Salyer.

Assuming that a further formal request occurs in writing, MTP will gladly present it's analysis of the current bus system and strategic starts for a comprehensive Oklahoma City solution to have a financed start by MAPS 3 and integrated into a final Metro-wide Solution as identified by the Fixed Guideway Study and currently a primary basis for the Regional Transit Dialogue process. Primary focus will be Modern Streetcar and an improved local bus service. Other factors to be considered in the report shall be bus stops, accessibility, local fuel sources, and technology improvements to increased efficiency. A mathematical analysis of current inefficiencies and strategic improvements is being assessed now.

Great news Urban Pioneer. It's good to see that we are making some headway with the decision makers about transit. Hopefully they will apply MTP advice and not just use them for political cover.

I have been very encouraged by the dialogue with our council members. Our committee is convinced that they are on the path to making a meaningful investment/downpayment on substantive transit assuming that consensus is developed on when/what MAPS is. I think the chamber will be willing to support transit as part of MAPS 3 assuming that this consensous develops. I think we are past the point of potentially being "just political cover".

I agree with Urban Pioneer, but folks, I can't stress how important it is to be VOCAL to the CITY COUNCIL AND MAYOR the next 2 days!

Urban Pioneer, it looks like I'll have something out this next week.

Hi there, I wanted to let everyone know that a system map is now posted to gometro.org (http://gometro.org/metro_transit%20folder/metro_transit/pdfs/09_METRO_System_Map.pdf).

For those interested in maps that show METRO Transit routes in correlation with major OKC employers and housing, let me know and I'll email you a copy personally. My contact information is as follows.

Michael Scroggins
Marketing & Public Information Manager
(405) 297-2107 • michael.scroggins@okc.gov

I agree with Urban Pioneer, but folks, I can't stress how important it is to be VOCAL to the CITY COUNCIL AND MAYOR the next 2 days!

I don't understand the 2 day part. What comment period is closing in two days?

Can't say just yet, I'm not saying we still can't be vocal after today (2 day period is up today), but can't stress how important it is to be vocal THIS WEEK! Keep in mind this thing (MAPS 3) has been behind closed doors for along time.

Thanks for the reminder Metro. Just sent in my "2 cents worth".

Great American streetcar scandal - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_American_streetcar_scandal)

Thanks for the reminder Metro. Just sent in my "2 cents worth".

Great! Everyone should flood City Hall with letters/emails today!

Encouraging folks to flood city hall with email or letters after 3:30 on a Friday?
That was interesting timing if nothing else. Luck with it.

Streetcar plan may open downtown transit route
BY STEVE LACKMEYER
Published: July 14, 2009

Longtime downtown resident Jeff Bezdek, tired of seeing transit discussed year after year is a man on a mission.

Bezdek, joined by three other downtown residents, James Ellison, Mark Gibbs and Austin Hacker, wants to see all the various plans dusted off and made a reality.

Their group, "Modern Transit Project,” proposes a modern streetcar system designed to flow with traffic. They suggest saving costs with existing bus operations by converting the Metro Transit fleet to compressed natural gas.

The group is pitching the plan to be included on a potential MAPS 3 ballot this winter.

For full article:

http://newsok.com/streetcar-plan-may-open-downtown-transit-route/article/3385109?custom_click=headlines_widget

Thanks for posting warreng! Great article and I hope this shakes a lot of discussion up in the City.

Thanks Steve for covering our project. To all interested, this dialogue will be ramping up and you should see more events, announcements, research, and campaigning as we rapidly begin to approach deadlines to construct MAPS 3 ballot language.

Thought I'd spread the word about the meeting.

Thursday July 16 APT Lunch Meeting Reminder

You may have received an Evite about this, but please spread the word:

These Oklahoma Alliance for Public Transportation (APT) meetings are open to all and lunch costs are affordable-$8.00- but you must RSVP by 11:00 on Wednesday July 15 IF you want a box lunch.

Brown bagging is ok. The location is at the Community Foundation (see below) and is along or near a couple of bus routes.

Over 40 have already RSVP’d to attend but there is still plenty of room for you so come and invite a colleague!

This program starts by 12:10 and will be completed by 1:00:

· City Councilman Sam Bowman of Oklahoma City will speak on his ongoing interest in improving public transit in the region and about his thoughts for the future of public transit here.

· Presentation other of results from the 2000 or so people responding to the voluntary Encompass 2035 transportation survey by Jerry Church of ACOG.

· Status update re the current Downtown Transit Circulator AA Study from Larry Hopper of METRO Transit, and hear about what is going on about possible downtown streetcars, commuter rail, and the other COTPA long range regional fixed guideway plans.

· Update re the ACOG Regional Transit Dialogue (RTD) by Doug Rex of ACOG.

· See inside a brand new METRO Transit commuter bus on display.

· Hear about the APT’s planned late July APT “Policy Initiative” committee meeting for APT volunteers, and sign up for that.

· And more!

Place:

1000 N. Broadway, the new handsome offices of the Oklahoma City Community Foundation at NW 10th and Broadway. BUT: park in their unmarked lots just east of the “Harvey Supplies” building on Tenth Street, or park along Broadway.

The APT, has had many well-attended 2009 meetings and invites you to get more involved in public transportation’s future here! Many came in June, including TV, radio, and newspaper media. APT will take break in August and but will be in contact by email. The APT’s next lunch meeting Thursday, September 17.

Sam Bowman came to the APT meeting today and gave a impassioned speech about needing to "re-think" how we provide our bus service in the future and reasoned that MAPS 3 Transit improvements should start with the streetcar first. Was anyone else on this thread at the meeting?

I have a legitimate question for everyone. Should the city attempt to reclaim or purchase the Sante Fe Train Station so that it is back in public hands and provide a direct interface between Amtrak and the proposed Modern Streetcar? Or should we construct a brand new station in/near Bricktown?

Assuming that this acquisition was made from the Brewers, the station could become ultimately a small hub for the streetcar, Amtrak, and future North/South Edmond commuter rail. The streetcar would provide a direct link to the bus transfer center and could be an much more impressive tourist visitor center than the current CVB.

I'll answer your question with another question(s): Can anyone say the station is being used for its best and highest use now? Could the station be used not just as a transit hub, but also as a visitor center and even a place where the city's history could be showcased? It's a pretty big space.

What does "interface" mean in the above context?

What does "interface" mean in the above context?

The "interface" means that the proposed streetcar and existing Amtrack would meet at a mutual stop. In the event that Edmond/Norman commuter rail is implemented, Sante Fe could serve as a small hub.

The streetcar would of course be at ground level. The existing parking lots would provide drop off zones, temporary visitor parking, and possibly a Taxi hub (off which I do not believe we have one).

The Brewers have already started to improve the place with their concept of leasing space for shops such as Envy.

Forgive my ignorance, why would an Amtrak rail and a streetcar rail actually intersecting be of value? Wouldn't the streetcar rail have to be elevated where the Santa Fe station is?

Why couldn't the streetcar go under the Amtrak rail?

Or am I just totally confused?

No. The streetcar would not have to be elevated. The streetcar would be on the street below and the Amtrak/commuter above.

The idea is to connect as many existing and future modes of transit together at one specific point so that transferring is as easy as walking a few steps to the other device. Also, such an interface would provide a direct link via streetcar to bus transfer station. We could "almost overnight" begin the nexus of an actual system rather than what we have right now- many things that aren't connected together.

Sam Bowman came to the APT meeting today and gave a impassioned speech about needing to "re-think" how we provide our bus service in the future and reasoned that MAPS 3 Transit improvements should start with the streetcar first. Was anyone else on this thread at the meeting?

Wish I had known about the meeting. Didn't see the notice about today's meeting until...today. I also have to say that I have ran out of room on my notepad where I try to keep a list of all the transit-related organizations that are sprouting up around here.

Was there any electronic record of today's meeting? Video and/or audio...or fail that, a transcript or something?

I also have to keep reminding myself that meetings are going to be just meetings until we actually get some funding appropriated for transit. I was attending these kinds of meetings, but they have all started to sound about the same to me--I mean, there's not much else to discuss when we have no money to spend on any sort of system. I'm starting to wonder if we might see the okc-tul high-speed link before OKC even breaks ground on a little ole' streetcar. I long for the day where I actually see something happen transit-wise around here. Hopefully that day comes before I die of old age.

:sheep:

I hope we get a light rail system, just for the sake of knowing we're not behind as usual. I hate knowing we're usually the last to get anything, or not even get anything new at all.

Plus I hate driving to Tulsa, but would love to go there form time to time. Light Rail would shave some time off of that trip.

Guess only time will tell, but I forsee old people whining about how we don't need this, as if they are the authority on life, because they are content sitting in their rockers on the porch.

We gotta think about the future, and I hope OKC isn't stupid enough to pass up the funding given to us for Light Rail development.

Sam Bowman came to the APT meeting today and gave a impassioned speech about needing to "re-think" how we provide our bus service in the future and reasoned that MAPS 3 Transit improvements should start with the streetcar first. Was anyone else on this thread at the meeting?

Yes, I was at the meeting.

Sam gave the impression that MAPS3 would include a 5-6 mile streetcar from St. Anthonys to the Medical Center, completion of the trails master plan and lots of money for downtown projects (convention center, etc.).

I liked his wishful idea of having a streetcar with a leg that would reach to the Zoo and this way include more than just downtown in MAPS3. That's something I could vote for.

I didn't like his comment that they, meaning city council, just haven't seen a push for transit spending. I'm afraid that with his comment about getting more affluent riders I see just where they're looking. Unfortunately this leaves the riders who need transit ( workers and tourist) out in the cold, literally.

I didn't like his comment that they, meaning city council, just haven't seen a push for transit spending. I'm afraid that with his comment about getting more affluent riders I see just where they're looking. Unfortunately this leaves the riders who need transit ( workers and tourist) out in the cold, literally.

I understand your concern. I think what he was trying to convey was that there has not been the consensus necessary in council for major system-wide improvements through MAPS-3. This is primarially due to the realization that MAPS-3 builds infrastructure- it does not provide the annual funds for project operation. Therefore, there has been reluctance to "double the bus fleet" as the council wonders "how will we pay the salaries and operational costs annually?".

I am excited to say that Sam and council have encouraged MTP to continue our innovation into finding solutions to these issues and this week we will crystalize how MAPS 3 can provide system-wide improvement infrastructure for everyone and construct the streetcar system all the while maintaining the current annual budget with no increases.

Look for new announcements and an updated website this week.

Like I have said before a light rail would only benefit the ones who cant possible depend on it more then the "working poor, the labor for the Bricktown, the elderly needing to shop or doctor appointments.
The City council isnt a friend of mass transit, except for the least needy ones.
I am all for making Downtown, Bricktown accessable ,but only in a wider Mass Transit improvement, more Buses, thats either Hydrogen/Electric, or even CNG powered fleet.
And the cost of light rail is too high based on population density and range.

Well if the city isn't interested in light rail, they better not fill out an app for funding for it, just to use it on things the money wasn't meant for.

I would love to go up to Tulsa sometime just to see something different, or see a movie on the IMAX, but hate driving down that turnpike. The longevity of the drive doesn't help things either.

I hope the city will do something smart for once, and get this light rail off the ground, so some of us humans can stop polluting the air with our cars, when we don't need to.

The thing to keep in mind is that the larger population wants to see rail transit. The proposal for the downtown streetcar is preferable because the minimal cost gives us a "First Class" rail system in the area which is the most dense- nearly overnight.

The streetcar represents Oklahoma's first re-exposure to "Class A" service. The results will be addictive and people will want more. I understand your concern GM wise. But the proposal on the table is a hefty down payment on the cultural shift, support, and funding to create the Metro-wide solutions to create a First Class system. It all has to start from the center though as that is where our density is high and our existing forms of transit travel (including our bus system).

Well if the city isn't interested in light rail, they better not fill out an app for funding for it, just to use it on things the money wasn't meant for.

I would love to go up to Tulsa sometime just to see something different, or see a movie on the IMAX, but hate driving down that turnpike. The longevity of the drive doesn't help things either.

I hope the city will do something smart for once, and get this light rail off the ground, so some of us humans can stop polluting the air with our cars, when we don't need to.

Light rail is in city use--high speed is intra city use.

Urban Pioneer,
We already have the necessary infrastructure ie the roads/streets for a improved Mass Transit for OKC.
Lets developed them ,and study the use of them to lay the modern streetcars rail ie light rail corridors to connect the high traffic areas with them.
State Wise we can go after high speed to connect Tulsa-OKC, maybe connect with other large Cities in our state, and out of state.

Maybe this is a dumb question, but would a street car use up a lane of traffic permanently? Or would it share the road with cars?

Maybe this is a dumb question, but would a street car use up a lane of traffic permanently? Or would it share the road with cars?

Depends on the chosen method. Some share, some don't. Shared lanes promote easy pedestrian connections (no crossing in front of vehicles) and require less right-of-way. Transit in its own lane lowers the risk of car-train collisions and can be more visible in general.

A downtown circular is a great proposal. After having worked in Denver on the 16th street mall, having a free transport around downtown is a great benefit. Denver's downtown is built within a few blocks each side of 16th and is extremely active and popular. OKC is more squared. The circular would work just as well I think and will only be used more and more as people move into the downtown area.

MODERN TRANSIT PROJECT PRESENTS BEFORE COUNCIL FOR THE FIRST TIME

Today, the entire Modern Transit Committee and board of advisers presented the plan for a MAPS 3 transit solution.

More can be viewed via the video link-

City of Oklahoma City | City Council Archive (http://okc.gov/council/council_library/forms/CouncilMeetings.aspx?MeetingID=217)

Fast forward to 2:19 for the presentation and dialogue with council members.

Great News Jeff! I will check this video out when I get home tonight.

Members in attendance of the meeting at council were

Walter Jacques
Professor Carol Bishop Gibbs
Dr. Mark Gibbs
Austin Hacker
James Ellison
Nathaniel Harding
Sarah and Koon Parks
Jeff Bezdek

It's official....I can't stand J. Brian Walters. He is completely out of touch with the big picture.

Ok... I've had moment to chill :Smiley127

I just can't help but hear SouthsideSooner's comment about Mr. Walters ringing in my head:

(regarding the DevonTIF disctrict... but equally valid in connection to transit)

Here's a great example of why Walters was a one term mistake that south OKC will correct in the next election. Walters tends to be on the wrong side of every issue and has isolated himself as a council member to the point that he is completely ineffective as a councilman for his ward.

From Newsok:

Options, road work top Oklahoma survey results
By John Johnson
Published: July 22, 2009

Motorists and commuters in Central Oklahoma want more transit options and better road maintenance for the region’s future transportation system. These were some of the conclusions from a survey that Association of Central Oklahoma Governments conducted in May.

The survey will help identify strategies to improve auto, bus, pedestrian, truck, rail and bicycle travel for the region’s long-range transportation plan, also known as the Encompass 2035 Plan.

Some of the key findings included:
• More than 80 percent of respondents drive alone to work.
• More than 80 percent of respondents live within 20 miles of work. More than 50 percent of those taking the survey said their one-way commute to work took at least 20 minutes.
• When asked what ways they would prefer to travel in the future, the top three responses in order were rail, car and bus.
• When asked what the top three priorities for the system should be, the top response was "develop passenger rail,” followed by "maintain roads and bridges” and "improve the public bus system.”
• When asked what would most improve safety while traveling in the region, "better maintenance of roads and bridges” was the top choice among respondents.
• When asked what would encourage them to ride the bus, respondents wanted bus routes to be closer to home and work, to run more frequently, and to have more service available earlier and later than the current schedule.
• When asked what funding sources they would support to improve the transportation system, respondents strongly suggested that no new funding was required. Rather, the existing funds and resources needed to be redistributed. Other sources that ranked high on the survey included a gasoline and diesel tax increase, and an increase on vehicle registration fees.
• The final question asked how respondents would spend $100 among a variety of transportation modes. "Road maintenance” received the largest cut of the money, followed by "passenger rail” and "public bus service.”

The survey was not designed as a scientific survey. However, results will provide insight into the priorities that central Oklahomans place on safety, bus riding, carpooling and mobility options and the most acceptable means of financing these transportation improvements. The complete survey results are available at Welcome to the Association of Central Oklahoma Governments (http://www.acogok.org).

http://newsok.com/options-road-work-top-oklahoma-survey-results/article/3386872

Mayor prioritizes modern streetcar in OKC for MAPS 3
Mayor prioritizes modern streetcar in OKC for MAPS 3 | OKG Scene.com (http://tinyurl.com/mf9jea)

We are updating our website Welcome | Modern Transit Project in Oklahoma City (http://www.mtpokc.com) with new article archives and just now, a video of the Seattle streetcar system. It is a very good video.

I read the site,, and I'm cautiously optimistic.

Ok... I've had moment to chill :Smiley127

I just can't help but hear SouthsideSooner's comment about Mr. Walters ringing in my head:

(regarding the DevonTIF disctrict... but equally valid in connection to transit)


I've never been involved in a political campaign before but I promise that I will be very actively involved in a campaign to unseat Mr. Walters when he comes up for reelection...

Urban Pioneer,

Congratulations for all of your hard work to move this issue front and center. Obviously, there's much more hard work left to do, but the mayor's literal endorsement of this is obviously a huge, huge deal.

Incidentally, everyone should click that link and view the video of Seattle's system. It is very, very exciting. It's interesting to note that the new Whole Foods in downtown Seattle, which is a fairly recent development, is the first grocery store in downtown Seattle in "decades," according to the person in the video. And it's definitely transit-oriented development.

What an amazing thing for this city if the streetcar project moves forward.

Thabk you Soonerguru. Both the video of the Seattle Streetcae system and the MTP presentation before council are now viewable on the site at Welcome | Modern Transit Project in Oklahoma City (http://www.mtpokc.com)

Mayor Cornett Speaks on the MAPS 3 Transit Proposal

What is Proposed and Why We Need to Do it Now

An Urban Fundraiser for the MAPS 3 Modern Electric Streetcar System

Skirvin Hotel
Crystal Ballroom
14th Floor
Thursday, September 17th
Opens at 5
Presentation at 6
Music Food Drinks + Visuals

RSVP ENCOURAGED rsvp@mtpokc.com

Down Payment on the Future - Oklahoma City - Big League City
Metropolitan Area Projects

Thanks Jeff, glad to see you got everything finalized. I will definitely be there.