Chicken In The Rough
12-18-2008, 04:39 PM
We do need a revamped bus service along with education to help break stereotypes about this transit mode.
Exactly. Does the city have any plans to dramatically upgrade its bus system? I love the idea of streetcars, subways, and commuter trains, but it seems all this must be fed by bus system. I haven't seen statistics in over 10 years, but OKC was once dead last among major urban centers in per-capita spending on mass-transit busses. We were also dead last in the number of busses on the streets for this same group of urban centers.
I find it a little strange and disturbing that cities like Alburquerque and Little Rock are years ahead of OKC in transit issues. I'm not knocking Alburquerque or Little Rock. They are both nice towns. But, they are towns. OKC should be playing on a level above them.
Urbanized
12-18-2008, 04:42 PM
Actually, that's exactly what OKC is proposing. A downtown modern streetcar circulator similar to this (http://www.portlandstreetcar.org/map.php). Not to be confused with Portland's Max Light Rail (http://trimet.org/max/index.htm).
I don't disagree with that at all. All I am saying is that virtually the same equipment can be used for both, and if it ever branches out to any of the outlying areas that Hot Rod mentions, especially if it has an exclusive rights-of-way over those routes, it would begin to closely resemble the definition of light rail.
I haven't been to Portland in a decade, but if I remember correctly, initially the service there was a free downtown circulator that became a paid route when it got outside of a defined area. At that point it had protected rights-of-way and increased its speed.
Like I said, very similar if not the same equipment can be used for both applications, whether it is sharing traffic lanes (streetcar) or has protected rights-of-way (definitely qualifies as light rail). That's the main reason I originally said OKC would probably see light rail first (which would probably originate with a downtown streetcar route), which could possibly expand to other nodes, and that in the distant (or not too distant, who knows?) future we may see commuter rail (sharing ROW with existing trains) to somewhere like Norman.
I just think it's important that people don't take away the impression that OKC is shooting for something like a vintage trolley, which was actually a component of the original MAPS.
PLANSIT
12-18-2008, 05:13 PM
^You're essentially correct. Only a couple of differences occur. General length of a train (modern streetcar = 1 car, LRT = 1 to 4 cars) must be considered in more urbanized areas where there is a potential for trains to block intersections, etc.
LRT trains come in two forms, level boarding and inclined boarding (stairs). If the transit agency chooses level boarding (which is more practical for higher capacities, hauling luggage, etc) they would require raised platforms, as level boarding trains are much higher than inclined trains. This would present problems with modern streetcars as they are nearly all level boarding, but sit very low.
Something to think about as we develop a plan.
Modern Streetcar Station (Level Boarding)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4a/Portland_streetcar.jpg/800px-Portland_streetcar.jpg
source (http://www.lightrailnow.org/images/por-lrt-stc-stn-shows-bulb-out-2003_d-clarke.jpg)
LRT Station (Level Boarding)
http://www.lightrailnow.org/images02/la-lrt-goldline-union-stn-pax-waiting-to-board-dusk-20060927-0864brx2_lh.jpg
source (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.lightrailnow.org/images02/la-lrt-goldline-union-stn-pax-waiting-to-board-dusk-20060927-0864brx2_lh.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.lightrailnow.org/facts/fa_brt_2006-10a-5.htm&usg=__IKn8XTHo37vPJkRTAFU9LmIDwFU=&h=429&w=644&sz=73&hl=en&start=3&um=1&tbnid=AJlMVKdT0ww5kM:&tbnh=91&tbnw=137&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dlevel%2Bboarding%2Blight%2Brail%26um% 3D1%26hl%3Den%26client%3Dfirefox-a%26rls%3Dorg.mozilla:en-US:official%26sa%3DG)