Why doesn't RSC advance higher into the collegiate forces of a 4 year program?

I've heard the argument of it being cheaper than most schools and wanting to keep it the way it is, but I feel it's losing out on it's potential of what it could be, I mean, just look at UCO and OCCC.

I'd like to see RSC move it's sports complex from the north side of the campus, to perhaps the 22+ acres north of 15th street between Twids and Sooner Elementary. Then RSC can expand the campus with buildings and other learning centers northward towards 15th.

Opinions?

No offense, but please don't put UCO and OCCC on the same playing field.

Why doesn't RSC advance higher into the collegiate forces of a 4 year program?

I've heard the argument of it being cheaper than most schools and wanting to keep it the way it is, but I feel it's losing out on it's potential of what it could be, I mean, just look at UCO and OCCC.

I'd like to see RSC move it's sports complex from the north side of the campus, to perhaps the 22+ acres north of 15th street between Twids and Sooner Elementary. Then RSC can expand the campus with buildings and other learning centers northward towards 15th.

Opinions?


I'm not sure if you meant to infer this, but OCCC is not a 4-yr college.

Why doesn't RSC advance higher into the collegiate forces of a 4 year program

I have wondered about this too.

I know Rose State has a partnership of some kind with UCO. Any classes that are taken at RSC are automatically transferable to UCO.

I think that is the most we can expect for the time being.

Also, I have heard that there were other schools in the area including OSU-OKC that were trying to expand into 4 year colleges. If this is true then RSC might be in competition with these other schools to get approval.

I threw in OCCC because, even being a two year, they are expanding faster than RSC. IMHO, yeah my Opinion.

@Deafguy, thanks for actually placing an opinion and not just clarifications or points of perspective that have nothing to do with the topic.

The last thing Oklahoma needs is yet another program expanding into a 4 year college. This of course as likely as not means we'll see another one, or three, within the next two decades.

KevinPate: Hear Ye!! Hear Ye!!

The last thing Oklahoma needs is yet another program expanding into a 4 year college. This of course as likely as not means we'll see another one, or three, within the next two decades.

Why do you think that?

I am not disagreeing. I am just curious.

Somewhat difficult to justify the expense for duplication of admin/overhead/facilities. If you're not aware of just how many four year publicly funded colleges and universities we already have in the metro area, and across the state in general, you might be surprised at what you find. Add to that the number of private sector opportunities, and a lack of conveniently accessible choices is not one of our flaws.

So, you think RSC should just continue to do the same thing forever?

I had a lot of friends when I graduated HS [Carl Albert] say they were going to Rose, the others, UCO. Of course a few of us went to other places like SNU. I know, if it were adjusted to a 4 year, a lot more of us, who also had college credit with Rose through the votech, when we graduated, would have went to Rose. So my argument is, there would be a lot more students going to Rose, in my opinion, if they were to do that.

It's nothing against Rose. I simply don't believe there is a need in the state to incur the expenses involved in creating and operating yet another 4 year school.
I'd feel the same if someone were asking about O-Trip, Eastern State, CASC or any of the numerous other jucos out there.

Understandable.

I know RSC is UCO's sister school. You can even take level 3000 and 4000 clases at RSC taught by UCO. You may be able to take all of your higher clases there and get a 4 year degree from UCO.

I know with some of the Cyber Security work at RSC, you can take it to Tulsa or SWOSU, i think.

Somewhat difficult to justify the expense for duplication of admin/overhead/facilities. If you're not aware of just how many four year publicly funded colleges and universities we already have in the metro area, and across the state in general, you might be surprised at what you find. Add to that the number of private sector opportunities, and a lack of conveniently accessible choices is not one of our flaws.

Those are good points and I agree. Sometimes I want good things to happen to Midwest city and it clouds my judgment and makes me a little selfish.

I think a little college atmosphere would do wonders for the Mid-Del area but I would not want the state to raise tuition fees and put a college education out of the reach of even more people.

There are probably a lot of Tinker employees and servicemen who would use the college complete their degrees,but you are right in that they still have several options to choose from in the metro area even though they may not be "across the road".

I see this happen a lot with "things" of general interest in Midwest City. Like for instance, our Golf Course, there are at least 4 that I can think of locally. Of course, you have your choice of which one you can go to. Even all the golf courses were of equal par [pun intended] that of which being, they were all designed the same, they all had the amenities, and prices were all the same. What would we your decision to go to John Conrad versus say Lincoln, Earlywine, or even Brookside? It would be distance, but say that the one farthest away had the same as everyone else, but offered cheaper prices. Would you still pay more and go to the closer, or make the distance to travel to the one with cheaper prices...

Before I go even further into examples, I hope you guys have picked up on what I am talking about. What would give RSC an edge over other colleges and universities?

I think a little college atmosphere would do wonders for the Mid-Del area but I would not want the state to raise tuition fees and put a college education out of the reach of even more people.

There are probably a lot of Tinker employees and servicemen who would use the college complete their degrees,.

Regards the expense of Rose state and tuition.

Are you aware that the Mid-Del citizens also hav e approved a property tax just for the support of Rose State. Considering the two major 4 year schools within driving distance of central Oklahoma why then would the property tax payers of Mid Del also want to support another 4 year.

Oscar Rose was intended as a two years school for precisely the people you mention above, Tinker employees and Service men.
There is an excellent curriculum designed especially to prepare those so inclined for a higher degree.
Not everyone wants something beyond a two year.
Again why should the property tax payers be subjected to a tax increase????
That is not a challenge to anyone but a legitimate question to ponder.:tiphat:

I've stayed off the topic so far, but it's just annoying me.

Rose serves the purpose it was intended for, and you won't find much support to turn it into a 4 year school. OKC already has more 4 year schools than it really needs. They may not be all public, but that doesn't stop a poop load of people from going to ALL of them, not just UCO and OU.

Rose and OCCC do MOST of their work with either training or people taking just a couple classes, NOT those that are really moving on to a 4 year degree. I read somewhere not too long ago that if you count the number of students enrolled at Rose, it's actually the biggest school in the state. HOWEVER, most of these folks are a 1 class or training person, not the typical student you would find at OU. They come in and take ball room dancing or something for a semester and get stuck on the enrollment numbers. So don't let the size of the student population confuse you.

Each school in the OK Higher Education program has a specific thing that it does. OU is meteorlology, OSU is veterinary, NSU is optometry, SWOSU is pharmacy, etc. They have programs that the others do not and will not because that's they way the state has planned it....pooling resources for specific programs to specific institutions to make them as good as they possibly can. Rose and OCCC fullfill the training aspect of education where other 4 year schools do not. That's precisely why they built their new employee training center near the aquatics building.

So keep Rose 2 year. Let them have all the partnerships they want with UCO or OU or whatever, but if you want that 4 year degree, then truck it on over to the schools that are designed for that.

I have to agree with bombermwc. RSC also serves many city employees through out the state at the Health and Enviornmental building along I-40. Many water resource employees go to class there to get updates on technology, and practical skills. The Tom Steed building also does adult continuing education, as well as seminars for different types of skills for businesses. So the school serves more than the military.
Rose State does a great job of getting kids ready for the rigors of college study, and college life on campus.
As far as extending the number of buildings, there is plenty of room to the northwest of the the tennis courts if the school decides to buy the property.

@bomber, that's fine. I was talking more about the aspects of them going to rose to get their general education credits before progressing to a major. For God sake, keep RSC a 2 year school. I'm more interested in more of the local kids going there before they decide to go to some other local school and spend their money there.

I was just asking about upgrades to the facilities and courses to improve the school so they can have the leading edge over other schools for our HS graduates to attend.

I come to this board not to get belittled but to start a conversation, apparently, everyone on this board has got it all figured out already.

If some of you couldn't tell from previous post, I had already agreed to what was being said, I even said, "Understandable". But you guys just have to jump on the bandwagon and put in your own two cents thats already been talked about. Thanks, no really, thanks.

Junior Colleges are designed and operated for a specific purpose. That purpose is to provide a place for people to either become more prepared for a 4-year college or to provide other avenues for education as opposed to a 4-year.

The purpose of a Junior College is NOT to grow up to be a 4-year college/university.....

This entire argument is like arguing why the bologna in my refrigerator doesn't turn into a T-bone..... I'm just sayin'

another person with nothing but negatives, we're over it now. You've pretty much already restated half the board.

Any one else want to put in there two cents and just repeat whats already been said?

another person with nothing but negatives, we're over it now. You've pretty much already restated half the board.

Any one else want to put in there two cents and just repeat whats already been said?

I gotta be honest with ya..... I didn't read the whole thread.... I just REALLY wanted to drop that "bologna to T-bone" analogy and couldn't let details get in the way.....

:LolLolLol

Finally, some humor. I think that's the problem, people are too worried about giving their own opinion. I just started this thread to find out about RSC, in turn, it became a ground for people to boast about how much information they knew and complain about taxes. Guess what, I live in Midwest City, and I pay taxes too.. imagine that.

But anyways, no hard feelings. I just wish it were more friendlier here and not a bunch of grumpy know-it-alls. If you feel offended by that last sentence, you're probably one of them.

I don't see why OKC doesn't have its own public four-year institution. Suppose you live in OKC, near MWC; your options are limited to paying extra to attend a four-year private school or driving 20+ minutes either north or south.

Sure, OKC has a lot of four-year universities, but we need at least ONE in OKC that is public.

Here are the four-year schools located in the area I would consider to be a reasonable distance to travel for the average person in OKC.

OCU - private
OBU - private
SCU - private
MACU - private
SNU - private (Bethany)
OU Med - public

What do you do if you can't afford to attend a private school? What if you're Guard/Reserve, and will only receive Tuition Assistance for state schools? Just because OKC has a plethora of four-year institutions doesn't necessarily mean we have a lot of options.

I'm not advocating I want RSC to become a four-year school. I'm just saying I disagree with the notion that OKC has too many universities. Private...yes, but public...no.

UCO isn't that far of a drive from Midwest City. It's pretty much all on the highway.

Yep... If you want a four-year degree, UCO and OU are both within easy driving distance from MWC.

The state can't afford the regional schools it has right now. Why on Earth would you advocate expanding that number?

I live in MWC and went to OCU - 15 mintues. My fiance lives in MWC and went to OU and now teaches there. It's no more of a commute than my commute from MWC to near the airport everyday. Seriously, less than 30 minutes from my driveway to a classroom at OU. Same goes for UCO.

mmonroe - i wasn't trying to belittle you, but your statements just seemed to be pushing for rose to be 4 year, it wasn't clear. Rose does offer top notch instruction and I feel does a great job of preparing it's students for a more rigorous 4 year institution. Their slogan works great because you do stay close and then go far. SOOOO many people start at Rose and then move on to any of the universities around OK or in other states. I took a couple classes at Rose while I was a OCU simply because of scheduling at OCU. With OCU being a smaller institution, they didn't offer all classes all the time, whereas I could enroll for that class at Rose and still get credit, with excellent instruction.

But this is a forum, so opinions fly more often than statistics. If you don't like that, perhaps this isn't the place to be. Harsh yes, but you have to take it all...can't be selective.

I do believe there is a difference between constructive and deconstructive, and i've witnessed a lot of deconstructive comments come, not just towards me, but others on this board.

But next step, what about upgrading facilities and the grounds at Rose?

Everyone is going to rub on someone else's nerves at some point...it's impossible to put together all the people that visit this board and expect everyone to get along ALL the time. Plus, when you can't see sarcasm, a lot can be lost in the delivery of some comments.

That said...doesn't RSC already have a really nice PAC? I want to say I saw Stomp! back in college at Rose State and despite the rows being REALLY close together, the sound was great and the facility seemed pretty new still. It amazed me that a 2 year college had a better PAC than a 4 year university with nationally-recognized music and theater programs! (UCO)

yes, the PAC is amazing, but the main campus could use a LOT of fixing up. I got a chance to take a look in their newest building off Hudiburg before it was finished being built. It looks great from the inside and out. I even like the new style directional marquee for the building as well.

Real live Rose graduate here. Got my original 2 year on the GI Bill.
That degree served me well for nearly 20 years.
I decided to expand my horizon and went to UCO in Edmond. Virtually all the course work fro Rose was transferable.
I recall only two didn't count towards my 4 year.
I think the college is doing an excellent job in up grading the campus. Several new buildings have been approved by the voters of the Mid Del Area and we continue to support that school.
No problem with your comments but ...........chill a little dude, you will get ulcers.....I know..............:tiphat:

That said...doesn't RSC already have a really nice PAC? I want to say I saw Stomp! back in college at Rose State and despite the rows being REALLY close together, the sound was great and the facility seemed pretty new still. It amazed me that a 2 year college had a better PAC than a 4 year university with nationally-recognized music and theater programs! (UCO)

That is a really nice building. When I took architecture classes at OSU-OKC I had a professor that did a little work on that building. He said there were some design flaws regarding how the seats were set up, especially in the balcony. There are a few seats up there, if I remember correctly, where you cannot see the whole stage. Other than that ,he said it was a nice building. I have always enjoyed going to events there.

I agree with Monroe that the main buildings could use an uplift. I think it will come in time.

Rose state is in the process of renovating Health, Physical Education and Recreation Building into a College Wellness Center. There is always something going on there and I think that is impressive for a smaller school.

Here is the link to renovations.Rose State College (http://www.rose.edu/commfriend/WellnessCenter/index.asp)

Keep in mind that higher ed in Oklahoma is traditionally one of the most underfunded services the state provides, in my opinion, right behind DHS.

Rose State's facilities are beautiful and pristine in comparison to many regional four-year colleges around the state.

The statistics aren't available on the internet, but I suppose you could break them down by looking at funding bills and dividing the allocations by student.

When I was at UCO, I was active in student government. I recall a meeting I had with one of the deans where he showed me the statistics of funding per pupil. UCO was dead last in the state as far as higher ed institutions go.

Sorry, but before RSC gets any additional money from the state, an institution which is gaining in size and importance quicker than any other public institution in the state (UCO) ought to have some strong consideration. With an enrollment in the 15,000 range, UCO, at least the last time I saw the numbers, back in 2002 or so, received less than half the funding per student than OU did.

RSC does just fine at what it does, but there is no pressing need for new facilities. There are other institutions in the state which are expanding rapidly and have far more pressing needs.

I wouldn't expect there to be some alumni bias in there would I?

I wouldn't expect there to be some alumni bias in there would I?

Sure. As an alumnus, I'm quite proud that my school was able to deliver what I considered to be a superior quality education at a bargain price. I had the opportunity to be involved in a fraternity, the leadership of student government, various clubs, be an anchor/reporter on the school's TV news program and be in the school's orchestra. No way in hell could I have done all of those things at a larger school. I'm still amazed that despite drastically lower tuition cost, far lower alumni giving and about half the state funding, UCO could afford to provide me that opportunity.

That said, I've seen the numbers. Compared to schools in places like Ada and Weatherford, UCO receives much less funding per student. Considering the role it plays in education in the OKC metro, I don't think it has enough money. While I was in school, the school had to tear down one dorm because it couldn't afford to rehabilitate the building. The iconic Old North Tower was also closed to the public due to structural integrity issues which were discovered during a facelift.

When I see OU and OSU building multi-million dollar facilities, I am saddened that UCO can't afford to rehabilitate what is probably the most iconic and is in fact the oldest higher ed building in the state.

Am I biased? Sure. Are you biased? Yep. We all love our alma maters. Maybe one day I'll be in a position to do something about the situation.

If you walked around the buildings at Rose and then went to somewhere like OU and UCO, I think you would see that Rose's facilities are far better than most. There are many buildings on OU and UCO's campuses that are from the WWII era that haven't had more than maybe 1 or 2 renovations.

Rose's buildings may not be super spiffy, but they're in excellent condition. They could use a little face lift inside like some new carpet, but they are doing much better than many of the larger universities....which is true for OCCC too. I'm not really sure why, but it seems like funding at the jco's (at least the big ones) is lower, but more stable, so they don't build big and crazy, but they build well.

I'd like to see Rose with new facilities to replace some of those 70's era structures, but when I walk around at Rose and then walk around UCO.....Rose is MUCH nicer.

Do you know how completely awesome it is that all the buildings are so close at Rose? Yeah adult ed. is near the highway, but most of the stuff is so close! It's awesome!

If Rose State thinks they need fancier facilities, then the money needs to come from Midwest City or private donors. That's how other schools make up for the the rest after the state funding, which isn't a great amount.

Actually, I went to SNU, not RSC. No bias here for RSC, just hometown pride i guess. I live in midwest city, i'd vote yes for a bond or small tax increase. I believe over all upgrading items around the city can attract more business and promote the city in a better light.

@bobmermwc, all the buildings close together, maybe that's what they meant by stay close go far. jk

I just like having the buildings close....i really was spoiled at OCU by having a small campus, but everytime I walk around at OU I think, " good god I would have to do this evreyday"

lol, just invest in a segway.