This to me is absolutely insulting. Using God and Christianity to try and get what one wants on something like this. It's just wrong.

I'm equally disgusted by that mailer, and I'm what you would consider the "unchurched," and frankly have little respect for what I call the "mega-church mentality.'' I certainly don't agree at all with many of the Promise Keepers philosophies, and that was referenced on the mailer.

Regardless, trying to "pander" to the mega-church masses was a disgusting tactic in what I consider a CIVIC campaign. I got one of those mailers in my mailbox, and just rolled my eyes. Humphreys is the silver-tongued devil, and a good "Christian" one, at that!


I won't go into any detalis about Humphries here either...I'll save those games for Betts who I imagine is yet another big box megachurch "christian" but I could be mistaken.

So what if she is? So what if she isn't? You don't have to be a mega-church Christian to see how this segment of the population was being played. (see above).


I believe we will get so much from a no vote.

Yes, we will get stagnant economic growth. We will get concert promoters starting to pass us over for Tulsa, Wichita and Kansas City. We will get pushed over in trying to compete for any other major event such as the Big 12 or NCAA tournaments. Our "brain drain" will continue to grow. Downtown development will falter.

In short, we will eventually get to re-experience what life was like during /after the oil bust when we see our City continue to lose our competitive edge to other cities.


they think we are dumb, fat,
As long as we continue to allow a bulk of our homegrown college graduates to migrate to other states in search of better jobs and more viable entertainment options, then perhaps we're not that smart afterall.

As for our being, fat, well, you just need open your eyes to see that they may not be far from the truth.


If we beat this they will have a new respect for us, middle class working families and small businesses will note that OKC is a good place for people like them, and I don't believe anything will change with big business either.

Exactly, nothing will change in big business, except that again, we will lose any competitive edge we are gaining to other cities who understand the need for major sports franchises and similar opportunities to continue to attract other businesses to our state. Our oil supplies are not going to last forever, and our medical/biotech industry is not enough to sustain us. We need more and more diverse big businesses to continue to help us grow and provide more, good middle-class jobs. Small business can't do it alone.

And while I'm happy being "middle-class," I think our state needs more diversity than that!

Regarding the comment, "I believe we will get so much from a no vote," you said:

Yes, we will get stagnant economic growth. We will get concert promoters starting to pass us over for Tulsa, Wichita and Kansas City. We will get pushed over in trying to compete for any other major event such as the Big 12 or NCAA tournaments. Our "brain drain" will continue to grow. Downtown development will falter.

In short, we will eventually get to re-experience what life was like during /after the oil bust when we see our City continue to lose our competitive edge to other cities.
* * *
Regarding the comment, "If we beat this they will have a new respect for us, middle class working families and small businesses will note that OKC is a good place for people like them, and I don't believe anything will change with big business either," you said:

Exactly, nothing will change in big business, except that again, we will lose any competitive edge we are gaining to other cities who understand the need for major sports franchises and similar opportunities to continue to attract other businesses to our state. Our oil supplies are not going to last forever, and our medical/biotech industry is not enough to sustain us. We need more and more diverse big businesses to continue to help us grow and provide more, good middle-class jobs. Small business can't do it alone.
I couldn't agree more. If this vote fails, whether an NBA team locates here or not, it will mark a change in course for Oklahoma City I do believe, and not a good one.

As for the poster's comments that you replied to, above, I find it hard to believe that there are those who actually think that way. I'm in that middle class group and will never be anywhere else. That doesn't mean that one must "think small," however.

As for the Humphreys mailer, I totally agree ... it was not a good decision by the Chamber to send that one out.

I couldn't agree more. If this vote fails, whether an NBA team locates here or not, it will mark a change in course for Oklahoma City I do believe, and not a good one.

I couldn't agree more with this statement.

I truly and honestly feel in my heart that if this Vote doesn't pass, we have just sentenced ourselves to a very bleak future ... we will have lost our momentum and our chance.

I don't want to be a part of this way of thinking.

When my kids finish college - I don't want to hear .. 'we're moving away to a real city with progressive thinking and plenty to do'....who knows what the future will bring, but I want to do my part now to move OK forward for our kids and grandchildren. I don't want to look back in regret and wonder about 'what ifs' as we watch this city regress and go backward instead of moving forward.

That flier is so silly... even though it does make some good points about giving our citizens a venue for events, I think it's a stretch and a bit below the belt.

fubuduba says, "I won't go into any detalis about Humphries here either...I'll save those games for Betts who I imagine is yet another big box megachurch "christian" but I could be mistaken."

Although I don't think my religious beliefs should be a factor in this whatsoever, I am proud to tell you that I belong to St. Paul's Episcopal, a downtown, diverse congregation that welcomes and has members of all ethnic groups and any sexual orientation. Don't be putting words in my mouth.

Just wanted to add that, I agree, FritterGirl said it very well:

"Yes, we will get stagnant economic growth. We will get concert promoters starting to pass us over for Tulsa, Wichita and Kansas City. We will get pushed over in trying to compete for any other major event such as the Big 12 or NCAA tournaments. Our "brain drain" will continue to grow. Downtown development will falter."

"In short, we will eventually get to re-experience what life was like during /after the oil bust when we see our City continue to lose our competitive edge to other cities."

While I have serious problems with how this is being done, ultimately, it comes down to what FritterGirl said above.

And that mailing, that's just unbelievable. Horrible decision. I don't think that religion should play a part in this at all; and that includes where betts goes to church. I wouldn't care if she is a charismatic Episcopalian who is a Buddhist at heart with a little Baptist to boot. It just doesn't matter.

A majority of the reps I spoke to are in the OKC area....I just got a guide, found the ones in the city limits and went to their offices.

Who cares where Glover lives? The point you should consider is whether he is making good points about the issue.

fubaduba,

I thought the flyer was disgusting as well. The picture link on your post is broken, so I fixed it for you. Here's the flyer:

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f313/fashionquote/mailer.jpg?t=1204464906


Wow. The gall.

Kirk Humphreys lives in the Mulholland addition and lived their while serving as Mayor. Mulholland is just about as close to the Edmond city limits as you can get and still have an OKC address. I could drive a golf ball from his front yard and it would land in Edmond. If I keep my right arm straight and my head down. Mulholland is Deer Creek Schools. Am I the only one in this city that sees this stuff? Do you ever get the feeling that somebody is pissing on your leg and trying to convince you it's raining. Wake up Sheeple!!!

Kirk Humphreys lives in the Mulholland addition and lived their while serving as Mayor. Mulholland is just about as close to the Edmond city limits as you can get and still have an OKC address. I could drive a golf ball from his front yard and it would land in Edmond. If I keep my right arm straight and my head down. Mulholland is Deer Creek Schools. Am I the only one in this city that sees this stuff? Do you ever get the feeling that somebody is pissing on your leg and trying to convince you it's raining. Wake up Sheeple!!!


The name Dustbowl is very fitting for you.

The name Dustbowl is very fitting for you.

Ouch, I'm going to cry. Southside seems appropriate for you, so there we just elevated the discussion about 3 miles up.

Prove anything wrong in my comments and I will apologize. Back to reality-based thinking now.

One of the great ironies of Humphreys' political career is that although he's essentially a theocrat, the state's social conservatives still thought he was too liberal to be a US Senator - mostly, I think, because he supported MAPS for Kids.

As for Mulholland - well, it may be next door to Edmond, but it's still Oklahoma City, and that's what counts in this context.

Everyone seems so caught up in who is in favor of this, who might be ekeing a tiny bit of money out of this. Isn't the bottom line how this affects our city? If you honestly think fixing up the Ford Center and having an NBA team is bad for our city, then obviously you're going to vote no. If you think fixing up the Ford Center and getting an NBA team would be good for our community, then you should vote yes. Just as we voted yes for fixing up the Civic Center and building the Redhawks Stadium. This is no different. Let's not get lost in who is promoting which side. There are people who are less than admirable and people who have been less than truthful on both sides of this issue. Vote for what you believe is right for our city, and don't hurt the city out of spite or anger towards individuals, regardless of which side you're on. That's not adult behavior.

Betts here is some good information from Edmondite/OKC Chamber employee Alison Abshere..she doesn't mention that the "organized opposition that is spending money" is comprised of delivery drivers, firefighters, teachers, retired folks...all just regular people. Abshere, Drew Dugan et al are PAID to do what they do, and thats it....Really kind of gross when you think about it.



Alison Abshere (Oklahoma) wrote
at 1:59pm on February 28th, 2008
March 4 is a critical day for all of Central Oklahoma. On this day the residents of Oklahoma City will decide whether or not to improve and expand the Ford Center. A YES vote will continue the momentum our city has experienced in recent years. Please help us inform our citizens about this important election.

We cannot assume that this initiative will be approved. The original MAPS vote won by less than 1,000 votes, and MAPS for Kids was passed by less than 300 votes. Every vote will count. We need to encourage all eligible voters - family, friends, customers, vendors and colleagues - to go to the polls on Tuesday, March 4.

There is organized opposition that is spending money to defeat our effort.

There are many who are still "undecided" that can determine whether or not Oklahoma City will move forward. Please remind people of the importance of this vote:

A YES vote improves our economy and helps us attract jobs

Kirk Humphreys lives in the Mulholland addition and lived their while serving as Mayor. Mulholland is just about as close to the Edmond city limits as you can get and still have an OKC address. I could drive a golf ball from his front yard and it would land in Edmond. If I keep my right arm straight and my head down. Mulholland is Deer Creek Schools. Am I the only one in this city that sees this stuff? Do you ever get the feeling that somebody is pissing on your leg and trying to convince you it's raining. Wake up Sheeple!!!

Humprheys has lived in Heritage Hills near downtown since 2005.

Humprheys has lived in Heritage Hills near downtown since 2005.

I stand corrected on his current residence. He DID live in the Mulholland addition in 2000. It appears if your info is correct, the house is listed in his wife's name and he does indeed currently live in Heritage Hills.


After living in Oklahoma City for 20 years, Kirk Humphreys will soon have a home in the Edmond School District.

However, the Oklahoma City mayor said the move doesn't mean his loyalties will be shifting.

"I'll be sending my wife down to Memorial Road (in Oklahoma City) for shopping," he said with a laugh.

The Humphreys family will move into its new home in the Mulholland addition, off Danforth Road and Pennsylvania Avenue, sometime next month. That puts them in the Edmond school district, but still within the city limits of Oklahoma City.

Some Oklahoma City Public Schools officials have expressed regret about losing the mayor's tax dollars to another school district.

Some Oklahoma City Public Schools officials have expressed regret about losing the mayor's tax dollars to another school district.


I'll bet they do. Exactly why we need to get people interested in moving back to OKC.

Bring on a pro team, build up the city, progress, bring more jobs, more corporations, more housing, more property tax bills .. more money.... there, you'll have your money for your schools. It's a no-brainer.

My property tax dollars have always gone to the city (with a brief, regrettable stop over in Deer Creek for a few years), but I'm excited about potentially moving them to a more needy district. If this vote passes, I'll be living downtown, which is precisely why I believe an NBA team is going to impact our city. I don't think I'm alone in being able to get excited about moving downtown if we've got a team and more things to do there. I don't really understand why our former mayor would choose to live in Mulholland over Heritage Hills, but like us, he may find out that it's a lot more convenient living in the city.

Although I agree that's the case, what hasn't been said is that for everyone who has any sort of transportation, this is a voluntary tax. Warr Acres claim to fame is their lower sales tax, so if people from there shop in OKC, that's their choice. Same with the Village. Although there's not a shopping center in the Village, you can certainly do your grocery shopping within the Village, and people who don't want to pay the tax can buy big ticket items online or in one of the suburbs. Most people without transportation probably fall within the group eligible for a sales tax refund or rebate. So, although they don't get to vote, people from any of the burbs also don't have to shop.

Actually betts, this argument no longer applies. You are semi-correct in that Warr Acres PAST claim to fame used to be 1 cent lower sales tax, but last year they passed a one-cent sales tax raise and now they have the same tax rate as OKC and several suburbs.

Actually betts, this argument no longer applies. You are semi-correct in that Warr Acres PAST claim to fame used to be 1 cent lower sales tax, but last year they passed a one-cent sales tax raise and now they have the same tax rate as OKC and several suburbs.

I pointed that out to her in post 54 of this thread.

Too bad they had to do that, but they've really had some rough times haven't they? They had a similar situation as the Village when they lost all that WalMart sales tax revenue.

My property tax dollars have always gone to the city (with a brief, regrettable stop over in Deer Creek for a few years), but I'm excited about potentially moving them to a more needy district. If this vote passes, I'll be living downtown, which is precisely why I believe an NBA team is going to impact our city. I don't think I'm alone in being able to get excited about moving downtown if we've got a team and more things to do there. I don't really understand why our former mayor would choose to live in Mulholland over Heritage Hills, but like us, he may find out that it's a lot more convenient living in the city.


Betts: I was incorrect that Humphreys still lives in Mulholland. He moved to HH in 2006.

Can I delete my own thread here? I can't find it.

I have edited this post since the moderators have removed Metro's post.

Some of you people are funny. I live in the Village, if you look at a map it is surrounded by OKC. Most of my spending is in OKC, but that doesn't matter. This is a tax vote, that will impact everyone. It will cost the average OKC resident $150 (every man, woman and child). These are the city's numbers - not mine. The taxpayers would fund changes to the arena so a new tenant can make more money. 90% of he people I talk with are against corporate welfare.

Quite a far cry from your talk at the council meeting. So you've gone from $500 a person down to $150, which isn't accurate. It's not the city's numbers...they say it's not their number too.

Your own comments here invalidate your arguement. You based your arguement that of numbers on the population of OKC...not the metro. And yet here you are talking about how you spend all your money in OKC. And 90% huh....I'm sure you have a legitimate source for that number as well. If you start looking around town at the big businesses we have, you'll see most of them got some benefit/tax cut. And if they didn't, we wouldnt have the jobs and they would be in another city with the benefits. It's a pointless arguement that won't hold water.

I'm really tired of these guys tring to make themselves important. They create this little group that says they speak for the community, which they don't, and then slander the hard work of the city to make something out of itself. I see no legitimate basis for your claimed representation of anything but your own interests. Plus, if it's such an important issue, where were you for all the other projects that were similar?

We'll see Tuesday that the city completely disagrees with you.
We'll see Tuesday how the majority is ready to vote yes to keep us moving.
We'll see Tuesday how OKC won't fall into the trap that Tulsa did because our planners are creating PUBLIC projects, not private. NO matter what you say, it's a public project.