here's a link, think it is the same content as Doug posted

http://www.istockanalyst.com/article/viewiStockNews/articleid/4507793

Well, if that isn't interesting. A secondary news source, in this case istockanalyst.com, picks up the story and reports it on-line despite that management at the Oklahoman refuses to make it available in its own on-line version. The internet is changing the rules, if anyone (like you, Larry) wants to pay attention. Good find, my friend. It may be that the internet might prove to be the best way to keep the Oklahoman honest, or, at least, report when it is not -- even though the istockanalyst.com source probably had no idea and was unaware of what was going on behind the scenes at the Oklahoman today.

Thanks to your link, Larry, I've been able to compare what Steve earlier posted at OkcCentral, now disappeared, in side-by-side columns with the content posted at istockanalyst.com, and the comparative content appears to be identical.

Something in what had all appearances to me as being just an interesting and harmless article clearly must have been seen by someone in the Oklahoman to contain parts that should not be reported.

Of course, the question is, what parts? Steve's article has all appearances to me of being harmless -- just a story of how one set of restaurant owners (Paseo Grill) was persuaded by John Belt, Paseo property owner, to acquire the interest of the former tenants of the failed Sauced restaurant.

Can we, on the outside, figure out what torqued the Oklahoman to remove this article? I'll be trying. Perhaps some of you might enjoy the sniffing, especially you, Larry (you've already established your credentials for this sort of critical analysis), and perhaps such a group could look at and help sort out what might have gone on behind the scenes at the Oklahoman today, as an example, but not the only one. An army of citizen investigators would not be a bad thing.

Maybe a standing army of local citizens, an Oklahoman watchdog group, might make a good contribution the city since only ad hoc threads like this one seem to be doing such a thing. I'm thinking that you, Larry, would be a natural to head up such a group. If you are willing, I'll be glad to help. Its easy and free to set up a blog, don't you know? Are others interested? Perhaps the time has come.

I have no idea why the Oklahoman link didn't make the full article available but I have the newspaper and can read it over and over again as many times as I please.

LOL

If that's censorship, I'm not sure what the purpose would be since it's easily available for all to read.

I have no idea why the Oklahoman link didn't make the full article available but I have the newspaper and can read it over and over again as many times as I please.
LOL

If that's censorship, I'm not sure what the purpose would be since it's easily available for all to read.
You are missing the point, ljbab. The article WAS originally on-line because I read it early this morning. Then, mid-morning, it was gone. After that, it was re-posted in Steve's OKC Central blog, where I copied it from, and now that blog post is gone as well. The fact that you can save and read your paper version as many times as you want suggests that you have no concern or inquisitivty at all as to what went on behind the scene today when the Oklahoman flushed its on-line version, then, in 2nd step, deleted the article in Steve's blog so that none could see it, at least not at NewsOK.com or its associated blogs.

Do those facts give you no cause for concern? Does this type of behavior not raise any red flags in you, ljbab? And if it occurs with respect to a relatively mundane article about restaurants on the Paseo, do you not see that it might recur about much more important things in the city such as convention center location or whatever else might come down the pike? Or are you content to give the Oklahoman a pass on whatever it might chose to do and you'll be happy with it?

You are missing the point, ljbab. The article WAS on-line because I read it early this morning. Then, mid-morning, it was gone. After that, it was re-posted in Steve's OKC Central blog, where I copied it from. Now that blog post is gone as well.

Does this type of behavior not raise any red flags in you, ljbab?

I understood your point completely Doug. My point was that such censorship was pointless and could serve no purpose after the cat was already out of the bag and in every newspaper rack in the state.

It could have just been a database hiccup or something.

My own impression was that Sauced had changed from being a pizza place to a bar that happened to serve pizza.

It wasn't a hickup, bornhere. What happened yesterday were deliberate acts on the part the Oklahoman, 1st in the on-line Oklahoman at NewsOK.com, and then in Steve's blog at OkcCentral.com which, of course, is also part of the Oklahoman's on-line resources.

I understood your point completely Doug. My point was that such censorship was pointless and could serve no purpose after the cat was already out of the bag and in every newspaper rack in the state.
That's good, as far as it goes, as far as this story is concerned. But don't you see the significance of this vignette as to a more pervasive Oklahoman approach to news writing and reporting on significant events that concern our city which we well be seeing in the future concerning small and large matters which affect the city more pervasively? This incident is not important just because someone in the Oklahoman's hierarchy had some as yet unknown problem with something contained in the article, probably concerning named persons in the article. Rather, it is important because it illustrates what the Oklahoman can and will do, whether the item involved be relatively small, or relatively large.

We've got a lot of big stuff coming up for future reports in the Oklahoman. There aren't that many Oklahoman writers still on the payroll who are willing to report objectively without regard to Oklahoman ownership points of view. Its a dark day for the Oklahoman, as a newspaper to be respected, I think. No one doubts the power of the press. But not that many are willing to challenge whether the Oklahoman press has the time-honored characteristic of being worthy of that trust.

I didn't realize this had been deleted from Steve's blog as well. That's where I read it earlier this evening. Your concerns are well-founded, Doug. I would have expected this from Ed Gaylord's Oklahoman, but I thought things were better now.

This is a concern of mine with online media in general. You probably read about Amazon deleting '1984' (of all things) from thousands of Kindles, after it was discovered Amazon had bought digital rights to the book from a publisher that didn't have digital rights to it. The whole book just disappeared from purchasers' devices.

It is also possible to edit a digital book post-publication and excise offensive material from e-books without users even being aware of it. This could have already happened, actually, without us knowing it.

Update: The physical on-line Oklahoman has not deleted the article (which can only be seen through subscription services or via the Metropolitan library website). Hence, the visibility of the article is limited via the general internet and ordinary internet viewers cannot see the article via NewsOK.com even if they can read it from other internet sources.

The 1st page of the Business section of the September 16 edition shows the article as existing, as follows:

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/misc/paseo_2.jpg

The article is not a figment of one's imagination, even if it no longer exists at NewsOK.com website or at Steve's OkcCentral blog, which have both been wiped clean by someone at the Oklahoman.

Who did that, and why?

Doug

I am honored and humbled. While I have seen different versions of stories before, I have only run across one other instance where the Oklahoman pulled a story online (think it was published as well, but am foggy on the particulars). It was a story on Chesapeake and if I recall correctly, wasn't exactly a favorable one. It got yanked rather quickly too. I could see why it got pulled but the article in question here seems fairly harmless and I can't imagine why it would be pulled in multiple places like that. It does give me reason for pause, but I am not ready to jump on the conspiracy/censorship bandwagon...yet.

Does remind me of an instance where I was the editor of a school run paper and we were running a short series of a historical nature about the school. We had the papers printed and the administration decided to pull that issue (before distribution). My instructor decided to run a story about censorship in its place. The administration had no problems with that (no mention of the incident was made, so it was an inside jab).

ON EDIT: yep, that's the one I read all right....

Thanks, Larry. I've known much too much that I haven't written about that causes my frustration point to boil and come close to boiling over vis a vis the Oklahoman. Much of that stuff I don't have the liberty of being more specific about. Some comes from vintage Oklahoman writers and some comes from some less so. I ain't got that many more years to live and perhaps its best that I devote that that time to ancient, rather than contemporary, history, since that sort of thing doesn't rifle up my basic health readings like crap like this item does. At this moment, though, I'm pissed, but I don't think that I want to go it alone, or even be the lead person. Given your articulate and long standing analysis, that's why I thought of you as the possible lead guy in some new venture. Call me or e-mail me if you are interested. I'll send you my cell phone by private message.

I thought it was a glitch at first too when I clicked on the Recent Comments area of Steve's blog (Doug Loudenback on Private: The Story of Sauced in Paseo) on the link took me to a "Ooops, that page not found"...then a few minutes later, came here and to this thread.

I read the article on my Kindle subscription.

I'm not one to rag on The Oklahoman too often as it's an industry under seige, but sometimes you just have to shake your head and wonder.

Doug, I guess there were just more important stories. Yesterday, I went to NewsOK.com and saw something so....bizarre...I had to take a screenshot. Look at the top story with the photo in the screenie below (I put a red square around it).

A man urinates on a building downtown and it's front page news? Not only that, this was a screenshot from yesterday - look when the arrest for this horrific crime occured: Sunday! (This was being reported 4 days later.) Folks, this is a major city newspaper. Like I said, sometimes.....

http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/5258/newsok.jpg

I think it is more likely that the simplest explanation is the best one. I have to say I am astonished at this thread though.

Reading this thread is like , who shot JFK conspiracy. I doubt the reason is as exciting as you wanting to be.

I'm not one to rag on The Oklahoman too often as it's an industry under seige, but sometimes you just have to shake your head and wonder.

Doug, I guess there were just more important stories. Yesterday, I went to NewsOK.com and saw something so....bizarre...I had to take a screenshot. Look at the top story with the photo in the screenie below (I put a red square around it).

A man urinates on a building downtown and it's front page news? Not only that, this was a screenshot from yesterday - look when the arrest for this horrific crime occured: Sunday! (This was being reported 4 days later.) Folks, this is a major city newspaper. Like I said, sometimes.....

http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/5258/newsok.jpg

Well said Mike.

When you gotta pee, you gotta pee.

I am not able to explain why the story was pulled. It is now re-posted in its entirety.

Well, ain't that sumpthin! But, good reporter, you parse your words too obliquely ... "not able to explain" means ... WHAT?

If you have questions about the operation of the website, editorial decisions, you should email news@newsok.com.
I just write and report.

And you do a good job, Steve. I'm glad we've got you here in OKC.

Oh, the old couch trick, eh? :sofa:

Speaking of sauced.....are you sure there was only V8 in that glass? Just kidding, Doug. But this seems a little much over what could have been just a silly error. Maybe not, but even then is it worth it? In my post I showed that The Oklahoman is capable of some strange editorial decisions, but I don't see the problem here. Do you have a theory or something? If so - could you share it with us?

I only know what I read in the newspapers.

It's a comfortable couch. It's fashionable. I like it.

Are you guys speaking in code? Are we going to have to call in the NSA here?

You'll need to contact your local chapter of Native American code-talkers.

Iway on'tday eakspay igpay atinlay

Ouyway reaway osway ullfway foway hitsway. Oops ... did I just give the code away?

If you have questions about the operation of the website, editorial decisions, you should email news@newsok.com.
I just write and report.

I thought your were OPUBCO's online ombudsman.

Could one of you guys just ship me my decoder ring? And an official membership card would be cool, too.

It's baaaack!!

http://m.newsok.com/s?s=16&a=3495471&f=business

It's baaaack!!

http://m.newsok.com/s?s=16&a=3495471&f=business
That's the cellphone/handheld link. The regular one is here (http://newsok.com/sauced-to-open-under-new-owners/article/3495471?custom_click=pod_headline_real-estate-housing) ... not in the Business section, where Steve's articles typically appear, but in the Money section.

But, MikeOKC, about that decoder ring and membership card, I'm working on that. Can't promise that the ring will work or that the card will get you anywhere, but it's a heck of an idea, and, hey, who can say?

The secret club is kinda weird. It involves geeking out over history. occasional disagreements followed by jellied meatballs and more geeking out over history.

I thought your were OPUBCO's online ombudsman.

Nope. I've already got a full time job.

Soonerguru, you should not throw around big words that other people do not understand.

The secret club is kinda weird. It involves geeking out over history. occasional disagreements followed by jellied meatballs and more geeking out over history.
Well, it's not fair to leave it at that, Steve. I'll share the meatball recipe:

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/misc/grapejellymeatballs.jpg

As for a membership card, well, I suppose that would need to be something that Retro Metro Okc (http://www.retrometrookc.org/) should consider. About a ring, I'm not aware that we have a jeweler member in our history group ... time to recruit ... but who? A young guy or some old guys ...

http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/misc/doug_1968s.jpg http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a49/DougLoudenback/misc/abbott_costello.gif

And, HappyDaze, Soonerguru's suggestion about an ombudsman (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ombudsman) for the city is a heck of an idea. It's a word well worth knowing, and it would be a marvelous thing for our city to consider.

Nope. I've already got a full time job.

Apparently you filed your sarcasm meter away in the desk. :)

What makes you think that he has a desk? I'm guessing that he carries his sarcasm meter right next to his camera and sound recording device.

Sticks and stones may break my bones, but online pot shots will never harm me. Nah, nah, nah, nah....

I made no pot shot ... I merely guessed that you had no desk, but maybe the Oklahoman is not that cheap ... you are always on the go ... and I supposed that you carried all of your equipment on your person.

Wasn't referring to you! Geez....

Well, then, master reporter, make your comments with exactness and clarity. But, to the point, do you carry your sarcasm meter on your person?

The company stopped providing it; I'll have to buy one on my own and get monthly per diem reimbursements ... don't ask me to explain further. It's corporate stuff.

Sauced. Serious business.

Wasn't referring to you! Geez....

Steve,

I wasn't taking pot shots either. You must feel embattled. My point was you do an awful lot to raise the profile of the Oklahoman on the Web. In fact, I can think of few if any people who do more "mixing with the masses" online than you. This puts you in sort of a reluctant ombudsman role. And by the way, you do a good job of it, despite the fact you're not paid to do so.

I'm not surprised Sauced went belly up. The company I work for did some work on the mechanical systems for them and we never got paid. They either couldn't afford to pay their bills or they didn't care about doing the right thing.

Yes, I do indeed feel embattled! Ah but now it's the weekend, and I'm looking forward to seeing the southsiders at Coit's tomorrow.

That's the cellphone/handheld link. The regular one is here (http://newsok.com/sauced-to-open-under-new-owners/article/3495471?custom_click=pod_headline_real-estate-housing) ... not in the Business section, where Steve's articles typically appear, but in the Money section.

But, MikeOKC, about that decoder ring and membership card, I'm working on that. Can't promise that the ring will work or that the card will get you anywhere, but it's a heck of an idea, and, hey, who can say?

Thats weird (even for the Oklahoman)...it appears to be back in the business section & the link Doug provided works but still can't find the story over at newsok.com thru the usual methods...using its search feature (which has always been iffy at best) for Sauced and Paseo brings up the old post that doesn't exist. Doug's comment over in Steve's blog is still a "Oooops, this page doesn't exist"

I'm not one to rag on The Oklahoman too often as it's an industry under seige, but sometimes you just have to shake your head and wonder.

Doug, I guess there were just more important stories. Yesterday, I went to NewsOK.com and saw something so....bizarre...I had to take a screenshot. Look at the top story with the photo in the screenie below (I put a red square around it).

A man urinates on a building downtown and it's front page news? Not only that, this was a screenshot from yesterday - look when the arrest for this horrific crime occured: Sunday! (This was being reported 4 days later.) Folks, this is a major city newspaper. Like I said, sometimes.....

http://img408.imageshack.us/img408/5258/newsok.jpg

What you are describing is an entirely different animal than what Doug is talking about. Your post shows the typical replacement of "top stories" on the home page. As a new story gets posted, another gets bumped off the short list. The "featured" story does seem to have some editorial selection/input as it can remain for days. What Doug described is the elimination of the story from the list entirely no matter how you looked for it. If you didn't have it saved somehow, you would be hard pressed to prove it. Also different from stories dropping off by a time element (say 48 hours) or being moved to Archive (60 days now?) if you have it bookmarked will get a snippit and the you-need-to-pay-to-view message.

My favorite oddities are the stories that show up in the list as "No Headline" and sometimes when you click on it there will be a story and sometimes not.

The DOK should start doing this more. Look at all the extra attention it has received from the online users.

No, let's not.

What you are describing is an entirely different animal than what Doug is talking about. Your post shows the typical replacement of "top stories" on the home page. As a new story gets posted, another gets bumped off the short list. The "featured" story does seem to have some editorial selection/input as it can remain for days. What Doug described is the elimination of the story from the list entirely no matter how you looked for it. If you didn't have it saved somehow, you would be hard pressed to prove it. Also different from stories dropping off by a time element (say 48 hours) or being moved to Archive (60 days now?) if you have it bookmarked will get a snippit and the you-need-to-pay-to-view message.

My favorite oddities are the stories that show up in the list as "No Headline" and sometimes when you click on it there will be a story and sometimes not.

Hi Larry. I know it had nothing to do with what Doug was talking about. I only was showing that sometimes The Oklahoman can do something that makes us shake our heads in wonder. A story like that a top story in a metro area of over a million people? I wasn't trying to equate the two in any way except bewilderment. But I also said I hate to rag on The Oklahoman too much because this is an industry under siege. Seriously. It's sad that so many newspapers, including The Oklahoman, has had to lay off so many good reporters and are a shadow of their former selves. I don't like it because I like newspapers. I think they play an integral role in the life of our nation that the freewheeling voice of the Internet cannot replace. Journalists are professionals and it's just not a good thing to see happen. Not "good" as in not healthy.

Journalists are professionals ....

Thanks Mike.

Steve's OkcCentral blog post which was the information source for this thread in the first place, is once again up and running. See http://blog.newsok.com/okccentral/2010/09/16/the-story-of-sauced-in-paseo/ . Humpty Dumpty is now put together again, for now.

I went in a few times…..nice patio. I asked for a glass for my beer and I got something a step above from a Sippy cup to pour my beer in. Some plastic piece of junk and it looked like there may have been two cups to choose from. LOL If you’re going to serve nice beer – at least have a decent glass to pour it into available.

The other time I stopped by – whoever was running the register decided to hang out and chat in the patio instead of taking my order……so, I cruised on. I can see how they didn’t make it if that was the attitude they showed to other people.

Went last night for their soft opening. The food was good and it seems as though they have taken note of the issues related to the place and "tweaked it."

For example, two cash registers now and a stage area for outdoor bands.