Many times I've been to the mall, never once....NEVER ONCE....have I ever witness any gang activities....INCLUDING NIGHTS!

I don't want the mall to die. I tell you this, I shop more at Crossroads than PSM. I have not been to QSM for many years.


Thunder's right - - - I'm there 3 times a week, all hours of the day and night. I let my wife shop there alone without worry....and I LOVE my wife. lol

If anything, this mall has more security than the others in OKC. They have their own security AND a sheriff's office AND usually a uniformed OKC police officer or two. They are trying to turn around the nay sayers who think it's unsafe and it's worked on me - I'm a believer!

They have even enacted Family shopping hours. Anyone under the age of 18 must leave the mall at 6 PM on the weekends unless they are accompanied by a parent and IT'S STRICTLY ENFORCED!!!

To those of you who are trying to kill this mall by badmouthing it every chance you get - Don't try telling others anything about the mall unless you have been there a time or two sometime in the last year or so because if you do, you aren't telling it like it is.

But, I suppose that there are always some people who think they are experts on everything.

Ray

Northsiders beware the world drops off sharp just two blocks south of I-40.

If they could do that and beef up security, all the families would start trickling back towards crossroads IMO.

They've already beefed up security. Have you even been there in the last few years? The place is adequately (overly?) covered with mall security, a sheriff's station and usually a city :police:man or two. What's :missing: are customers.

karenagypsy's right - It's a great place to shop and the merchant's are delighted to see me and have my business. Are they glad to see you where you usually shop?

Ray

Sounds like you're a southsider!

Geez, more cancerous southside hatred....

Whoever is knocking southside because they feel they live in a place that has it better, is demonstrating arrogance at its best.

Ironically that arrogance will come around full circle, and destroy them from within first. Then they will live a life of regret. Take it from someone who knows what arrogance brings.

Southside needs the businesses Moore, Norman, and northside are attracting, and I would love to see this mall renovated.

However, what I have learned from the mall merchants, is that the mall charges an insane amount of rent, and when people there suggested the mall be renovated, since everything inside except for the ceiling is circa 1974, they were shrugged off.

That mall has serious potential. It is massive, and wide open, but it will have to start with someone who is dedicated enough to see it flourish like Quail and especially Penn Square, are... Once they redo the inside, make it look really nice, I bet stores would come back, if they made the price reasonable enough...

Do you think Dillards and JC Penny like being away from the metro? I bet they don't. They have no other choice though. I would've moved too, if you heard some of the things I have about the mall's owners.

I would so love to see that mall renovated inside and out. That would help in the development of the areas outside the mall. The strip mall outside the mall, Best Buy would probably stay after their lease is up, and all of the empty areas outside the huge circle surrounding the mall, would be beefed up with new businesses.

I gaurentee it. However, as long as the owners keep up with phony excuses about how strip malls are taking their business away (while Penn Square is not hurting at all,) and malls are a dying breed, then nothing will happen. They have to man up, not make excuses, if this mall is to make a comeback.

I've lived in Moore all my life, so it saddens me that so many businesses have pulled out of Crossroads. I'm not letting that stop me from shopping there. I'd much rather go to Crossroads, where I can get decent parking & run right in, pick up what I need & get out in a flash - as opposed to having to deal with the nightmare that is PSM & QSM. With regards to the "gang activity" at Crossroads, there have been a few isolated incidents of crime but nothing to my knowledge that's really been considered gang related. Like someone before me stated, they've got family hours now & more than adequate security. In most recent news, isn't PSM where people are getting attacked in the parking garage?

yes it always seems like psm is where the parking lot attacks occur.

yep, I believe there have been multiple attacks in the penn square mall parking garage. anyone else think the name of this thread needs to be changed? they did it for coffee slingers....lol

yes it always seems like psm is where the parking lot attacks occur. It seems it has happened on more than one occasion, however, maybe the reason is that PSM serves a more wealthy, affluent demographic area so the crooks from all other parts of the city know they can hit up people with more disposable incomes in my own personal opinion. As I mentioned before, CRM is dumpy, ratty mall that has served it's purpose. They need to bulldoze that building along with all the other trashy areas and start over again.

Heritage Park Mall is not dead!

lol.

Heritage Park Mall is not dead!

lol.

You're right! HPM is still not dead, so from that standpoint, it is unlikely for Crossroads to die anytime soon. Heritage is holding on a good while (years) away from total death.

You're right! HPM is still not dead, so from that standpoint, it is unlikely for Crossroads to die anytime soon. Heritage is holding on a good while (years) away from total death.

Crossroads is not dead but it might as well be. Look at the sign outside of the mall. There is only one feature: AMC. That is not even part of the mall. The targeted demographics of most malls do not go to Crossroads not because it is unsafe, but because there are not many stores of their liking present. Crossroads cannot survive with primarily locally owned stores in there. It is neither a suburban upscale shopping center, nor is it a historic one. The mall needs Gap, not Nissi Clothing. Express, not Excellence In Fashion. Eddie Bauer, not Eastern Treasures. Bath and Body Works, not Kool Stuff. The mall doesn't need 4 empty anchors. Until there are the well known, respected stores in the mall, it will not survive. End of story.

Sorry to say this...but Crossroads simply has no viable future as a retail center. I do agree that Crossroads should be "saved" though - I really do want to see the mall retooled for another purpose (or a variety of purposes!), which I hope is a goal that the folks here that want to save Crossroads can get behind. Such a use could be a boon for the area community and/or Oklahoma City as a whole. You could have community/government/education/church tenants that would be beneficial to the community, and also make Crossroads a business center that could compete for business with Moore/Norman/MWC/etc. It would be quite a shame to see the existing building go to waste and see it rot away and ultimately be demolished.


You're right! HPM is still not dead, so from that standpoint, it is unlikely for Crossroads to die anytime soon. Heritage is holding on a good while (years) away from total death.

Typically the term "dead mall" simply implies an extremely high vacancy rate, and not necessarily the mall being shuttered. Given that Heritage has no anchors aside from Sears and very few stores remaining (I can probably count them on my fingers), and that Crossroads has zero anchors and that the vacancy rate is probably about 50% and rising, I would say that both of them can be considered dead malls.

Crossroads is not dead to me when I see plenty of traffic inside. :LolLolLol

yep, ... anyone else think the name of this thread needs to be changed? they did it for coffee slingers....lol

A valid point. We're ten months into the thread, and even without the then existing anchors, the mall is still going forward, at least for now.

Someday may come the day to :whiteflag
But after ten months of predictions, perhaps today is not that day.

i dunno... the decline of a mall is a much slower process than the decline of a small business. i'm not so sure that the thread title is unreasonable here... even though crossroads is hanging on, it'd be tough to say that it's not on the skids.

-M

A mall without anchors is a soon to be completely dead mall. In this economy the mall will not make the end of the year.

It's laughable people are even comparing Crossroads to Penn Square. Penn Square serves a completely different demographic. Just because PSM has a few parking lot attacks very rarely, doesn't make it a dead mall. Going into a half empty mall, with an eery feeling and no anchors or major national tenants, I'd consider that a pretty dead place, even if it is still on life support. Crossroads is alive, but in a vegetative state.

I never said PSM was dead; I brought up the PSM parking lot attacks as a point of reference for the folks saying Crossroads was unsafe. Just trying to point out that one isn't necessarily more or less unsafe than the other; regardless of whether the mall is "dead" or not, crime happens everywhere.

I haven't done a stufy, but i would not be surprised if someone undertook one and discovered CRM is far removed from being a hot bed of criminal activity, violent or otherwise.

Crime free? Nope. But a relatively low crime incident area - yeah, that wouldn't surprise me much.

I gaurentee if Crossroads ever revamped the interior, it would attract new business.

I bet it could easily get a -

- Buckle
- A&F
- Hollister

and many more... I list those three, because that is where I like to get my clothes.

Then get back some of the Anchors who would like to be appropriately placed.

I bet it could get Dillards and JC Penny back. Look at how they still own those buildings of the mall.

The problem is the mall itself... It has looked the same since 1974, minus the ceiling which was redone in the early nineties.

I love the mall to death, but even I have to admit the place is dark and dank. A resemblences of colors from the 70's and early 80's...

The mall merchants begged the owners to renovate and modernize the mall, but they were so high on themself money wise, they refused to listen to the tenants, so they bailed. That is the greed of money for you.

First things first... Renovate the mall... Make it cosey. Make it look as nice as PSM or QSM, advertise good rental fees, and watch as the area inside and out, flourishes...

They still own those, because no one paid the minimum bid for the mall at the auction....

In round about way Crossroads Management killed the mall....

1. Building the old Best Buy shopping center that blocked the view of the mall that has yet to be at 100% occupancy since it was built. That center could have easily been built on the east side of the mall on the site of the torn up parking lots that have not seen cars since the 80's.

Anybody in their right mind would have saved that space for eateries and service oriented businesses.

2. Years of no remodels or recruiting of major retailers.

3. No serious effort to land a replacement for Wards. They could have easily recruited Sears to that location. Just simply because they had every piece of the puzzle to make a good location for Sears.

4. They should have invited Wal-Mart or build the new Supercenter on the Mall perimeter. instead of 240 and Santa Fe. The store is already a dump because they built the store way too small for the amount of traffic flow. Chances are more than likely they will relocate again and turn that store into a Sams Club.

5. Instead of fighting to stay in the competition they just went to sleep and let the suburban developers take their business.

Wasn't the Best Buy in that location built as a Jumbo/Oklahoma City Sports location? I think Best Buy moved in after the sports store closed.

Thats correct but the Best Buy was originally located right next door, where the gymnastics place is now.

That's right, I was thinking they moved at some point. I was maybe in the south location twice, when the northside store was out of something.

In the right hands, this mall could come back.

I feel like I could manage this mall better.

I don't think anything can help to bring Crossroads back. All the development has moved to MWC and Moore and there isn't any reason for someone to go in there. Even if there were some anchors, the area is so depressed that no one will visit.

Penn works because the area has stayed nice enough and the mall has been well maintained. They managed to get the stores that aren't seen in every strip mall in the world. What was special at Crossroads???

what on earth could they do with that building if the mall is done, it took shepard mall awhile to get anything in there now its pretty full or was before AOL left, not sure now but there are always a ton of cars there....

Should it cease being a shopping mall in the future, possibilities exist for the space, so long as its structurally sound and the price points are in line with other locations. retail is based on location, location, location, but most anything else is based on easy access and price point.

Of course, when that interchange gets a workover, access will be an issue, mall, office park, residential, or whatever is there at the time.

turn it into a indoor bourbon street with the anchors being hotels, you have to stay in the hotels to attend the party bars and clubs inside the mall ( no public intoxications since its all indoors and no drunk driving) lol just thinking a bit crazy today

Well it happened again.

I haven't even thought of Crossroads in a long while, but I had that dream again.

The first time I had the dream, which I shared in an earlier post on this thread, I saw the renovated mall from the old Picadilly/Braums wing.

Now for some reason I was somewhere, and ended up in the middle of the mall, near 5-7-9.

I was with a friend, and I told him, "hey remember I told you I had a dream about white marble floors with green marble diamond?" He said, "yeah," and I said, "well here it is. My dream came true." Then I woke up.

When I have dreams like that, they usually come true.

Looking from the middle of the mall, it seemed wider. Meaning I think they cut a chunk out of all the stores, so they weren't deeper, more then they were wide. Like mall stores are nowadays.

It was REALLY nice looking from the middle, and the mall was full of stores. It still had a brown feel to it, but WAYYYY nicer, and way more modern. I didn't notice any food places nearby, so I am guessing they built a food court somewhere else in the mall.

Man I hope this is what really happens. Like I've said before, or maybe, I have had dreams where I've met people, before meeting them in person. I had a dream in December I was holding my newborn baby girl, and making her laugh... That was 4 months before finding out, I was having another baby girl, which isn't due to be born, until June. When I took my fiancee to the hospital for her ultrasound, they asked me, "Can you guess what it will be?" I said, "I know 100% it will be a girl." The lady asked me, "why do you think that?" I said, "Because I had a dream I was playing with a newborn baby girl in my house that looks like my daughter did when she was first born." Sure enough the lady looked at me, and said I was right.

Can you dream me a Ferrari?

LOL

I think dreaming about a baby girl is a little different. First of all, thats a 50/50 shot... better than you'd get anywhere in vegas

second, your vision of that mall sounds hideous.

No kidding, green marble? Who uses green marble these days?

It is green marble for pillars on the wall, with white marble flooring, with small green marble diamonds in the middle of every four white marble tiles on the ground.

I could be wrong in calling it marble on the white and green, but that is the best I can describe the look.

Even if it is a 50/50 shot at having a girl, I knew 100% from that day in December that in 4 months, when it was time to find out what it was, that it would be a girl. Told fiancee when she said it would be a boy.

However, I will omitt that dream, and see if you can answer this.

In early 2000, I had a dream I was with a girl. She had a certain look to her. In the summer of 2001, when I broke up with my then girlfriend, I was at my modeling agency, and sure enough, I met the girl I saw and was with, in my dream in early 2000. Also convienant that we met while I was single, just like the dream I had when I was still with the then girlfriend in early 2000. Something that happened in my dream between the girl I met in 2001, and myself in early 2000, happened during the summer. We went to Las Vegas.

I'd like to see what everyone thinks about that. There is no 50/50 there, with so many humans on the planet already.

Now here is something potentially bad, or maybe it can be used to save a life.

At my current house, I had a dream. All I remember in this dream is cleaning the bathroom, and thinking how my 3 year old daughter suffered while dying. I then thought about how she drowned somehow, that part wasn't clear. I walk out of my bathroom and look at pictures that were hanging in my hallway... I noticed the pattern on the pictures right before I woke up. Three months later, my fiancee comes home, with some picture frames. She hangs them up while I'm writing my screenplay in my bedroom turned office. She asks me to take a look and give an opinion on if they looked nice. I go out, and guess what? They're hanging in the same spot as my dream, and they're the same color, and pattern... Only thing is, my daughter is still alive. So I use that dream in constantly reminding my fiancee that anytime she goes out to her mother's house, to make sure my daughter Jillian, doesn't somehow slip away from their eye's, long enough to get to the swimming pool, and fall in.

Infact, anytime Jillian is going to be near water, I make sure she is overly supervised, as that dream could've been telling me how to save a life.

It just goes to show that sometimes you are allowed to see beyond the box, and use it in a good means. Wether it is to see parts of a potential future, or to save someone from a horrible accident.

Explain those last two dreams for me.

Since I'm a medical doctor, I have the unfortunate power to declare a patient dead. In this case, the doctor is in, and I declare Crossroads Mall dead! Stop life support. Stop CPR. Crossroads has DNR/DNI orders in the chart.

Explain those last two dreams for me.

Well, I have a lot of dreams "come true." It runs in my family. And I believe in the "sight." But what you are doing and how you are handling it strikes me as calling out for a medication evaluation. No offense. I'm being dead serious. When these fashes start causing you to restructure your life based on an attempt at interpretation, which may more may not be correct, that is not the "sight." That is something else. My opinion, anyway.

Well I don't let my visions run me...

I simply tell my fiancee to make sure Jillian is always inside the house when my fiancee goes to her parent's house.

I look at it as I could've potentially found a way to save Jillian's life.

As for the mall dreams... I haven't had that mall on my mind recently, as much as I've had getting my first short movie completed. So I think someone will come along, and fix the place up.

Just a few tidbits between dream interpretations..

Sears *was* recruited to take over the Wards space at Crossroads. The problem was that Wards *owned* the space they occupied, which then became entangled in the bankruptcy proceeding that dissolved Wards.

By the time Crossroads management got through the legal entanglements, Sears was having (more) troubles, and was no longer interested even though they did not want to stick around that increasingly unfavorable 44th street location.

Now, both are stuck.

I've mentioned this before, but I've heard rumors for years that the *early* years of Crossroads management were entangled in warring factions among the owners which had less to do with Crossroads itself than the war of between the owners. Years of neglect finally took their toll.

For those that think gangs roam the halls of Crossroad's Mall, nothing could be further from the truth. I was there all day today and if there was to be any kind of "rumble", it would have to be between the gang members who use canes and those who use walkers.

I just don't buy that Crossroad's is any less safe than any other mall in OKC. If it was, would the elderly choose to come there for their walking exercise? Would young parents bring their little children there to ride the wonderful carousel and use the indoor playground? I don't think so.

Come check out Crossroad's, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised.

Ray

Atlanta, again its the PERCEPTION the mall gives, not necessarily the actual crime stats. As others have stated, the mall is severely outdated, poorly lit, parking lot crumbling, no major tenants, it's just a weird vibe. To most American's PERCEPTION IS REALITY, nobody actually surfs the web tracking crime stats before they decide to go shop at a mall. Crossroads Management has done a poor job at cleaning up the place or changing the perception, that is why it is a dead mall.

http://www.deadmalls.com/malls/crossroads_mall_ok.html

There is a store that is widely known to only sell clothing and other items to people that claim to be in a gang. The shooting that happened at the mall was outside of this store. If you think there are no gang members shopping at Crossroads then you are fooling yourself. Where else are they going to buy their shirts with "13" on them? It is a dead mall, let it go.

Two words: Bannister Mall

There is a store that is widely known to only sell clothing and other items to people that claim to be in a gang. The shooting that happened at the mall was outside of this store. If you think there are no gang members shopping at Crossroads then you are fooling yourself. Where else are they going to buy their shirts with "13" on them? It is a dead mall, let it go.

I thought it was in/outside of JCPenney's.......I know they've moved, but back when it happened they were still there. So, what is the name of the store you are speaking of?? I think all you're going off on is speculation.

Here is the link (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13013020/from/RSS/) to the story. If you read it, you will see that the shooting happened near the entrance of a department store (JCPenney's)...

I thought it was in/outside of JCPenney's.......I know they've moved, but back when it happened they were still there. So, what is the name of the store you are speaking of?? I think all you're going off on is speculation.

Here is the link (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13013020/from/RSS/) to the story. If you read it, you will see that the shooting happened near the entrance of a department store (JCPenney's)...

I cant remember the name of the store either, buts its pretty much a gang clothing store. There are a couple around town, another one is on Penn just south of SW29th.

New proposal:

Crossroads Mall: The World's Greatest Indoor Paintball Facility.

It wouldn't get any awesomer than this, folks.

How much is the mall worth? Anyone know? Like if I wanted to buy it?

How much is the mall worth? Anyone know? Like if I wanted to buy it?

Plan to convert the mall into an OKCTalk headquarter? :LolLolLol

Here is the link (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13013020/from/RSS/) to the story. If you read it, you will see that the shooting happened near the entrance of a department store (JCPenney's)...


You'll also see that you are all dredging up OLD news!!! 3 years ago, in fact. Let me ask all of you "this mall is dead" people this, if someone walked into your church tomorrow morning and killed someone sitting in a pew, would you never set foot in that church again? If so, you're letting the bad guys win.

I'm not into that.

But then, I would have taken a plane trip on 9-12 and I bought stocks as soon as the market opened back up after 9-11 as well. I'm just not willing to get scared off by something so minor. Things happen but I don't let fear run the way I do things.

But, if you are too chicken to shop in a certain mall because of old news and if you are unwilling to invest in America because the terrorists don't want you to and you're afraid to go on vacation because years ago planes were used as weapons....well, then I feel sorry for you that you are so timid that you let others control your life for you.

Me, I'm not into that either!

Ray

I think it's the shopping experience. I went there Saturday, and didn't even know that Spencer's was still there.

The mall has so much potential, and all the tenants have TOLD me, that they begged the owners to lower the rent. The owners didn't oblige. They said, "well at least make the mall look modern." The mall owners didn't oblige.

To them, money was all that mattered. Not their tenants. That is what I believe, hurt the mall.

I mean heck, the mall has the very same cracked floors, as it did in the 90's, 80's, and back when they were new in 1974. The mall looks dated, and if they want business back, like the guy in Spencer's told me Saturday, they need to beef the place up. Make it look new.

Until that happens, you're going to have a hard time attracting new businesses. Look at Heritage. No new updates to the mall in terms of look, and it dies. Heck even Sooner Fasion has kept up with the times, and look how much that mall has sprouted.

Penn and Quail look so nice, have dedicated food courts, and theatres inside the mall, that one can't help but shop there.

I have so many memories of the mall, I don't want to see it die. However, greed is what is causing this mall to lose its base with the tenants. The NEW owners, need to put the spark back in. The mall can't do it, itself.

How much is the mall worth? Anyone know? Like if I wanted to buy it?

I think the minimum bid was $12 million at the auction and no one even came close to that. Seems like the article was posted somewhere on this site, but I don't feel like searching for it.

I think they should just level the place, concrete over it, and pretend it never existed. Same thing with Heritage Park Mall.

I think it's the shopping experience. I went there Saturday, and didn't even know that Spencer's was still there.

The mall has so much potential, and all the tenants have TOLD me, that they begged the owners to lower the rent. The owners didn't oblige. They said, "well at least make the mall look modern." The mall owners didn't oblige.

To them, money was all that mattered. Not their tenants. That is what I believe, hurt the mall.

I mean heck, the mall has the very same cracked floors, as it did in the 90's, 80's, and back when they were new in 1974. The mall looks dated, and if they want business back, like the guy in Spencer's told me Saturday, they need to beef the place up. Make it look new.

Until that happens, you're going to have a hard time attracting new businesses. Look at Heritage. No new updates to the mall in terms of look, and it dies. Heck even Sooner Fasion has kept up with the times, and look how much that mall has sprouted.

Penn and Quail look so nice, have dedicated food courts, and theatres inside the mall, that one can't help but shop there.

I have so many memories of the mall, I don't want to see it die. However, greed is what is causing this mall to lose its base with the tenants. The NEW owners, need to put the spark back in. The mall can't do it, itself.

This

Okyeah: I do not know what the media said, I never go off of that. I know what I saw in the video of the shooting. The shooting at Crossroads was in front of the "gang" clothing store from the video I watched. JC Penny or another store could have been nearby but I dont know.

Atlanta159: Your scenario does not fit completely, you left out a variable. Would you still let his "friends" that came to church with guns still in church after a shooting? Do not forget there are several different sets of "friends" that do not get along that have guns.

I was in there yesturday and looks like Twids Sporting Goods I think thats the name is having a Rawlings sale in the old Montgomery Ward/Steve & Barry's space in the upper level and Kool Stuff has closed it's doors.

Okyeah: I do not know what the media said, I never go off of that. I know what I saw in the video of the shooting. The shooting at Crossroads was in front of the "gang" clothing store from the video I watched. JC Penny or another store could have been nearby but I dont know.

Atlanta159: Your scenario does not fit completely, you left out a variable. Would you still let his "friends" that came to church with guns still in church after a shooting? Do not forget there are several different sets of "friends" that do not get along that have guns.


So, you are scared of what you saw in a 3 year old video? Geez!

How long since you were in Crossroad's when you saw these gun totin' "friends"? How about never? So go shop at Quail Springs and Penn Square where they have metal detectors on every entrance.

What, they don't have metal detectors? Well, then I guess you can't go there OR to church either for that matter.

:053:Pity to live one's life so afraid of shadows and things that go bump in the night.

Atlanta159: I give you an answer you dont like so you retreat to......uh your just scared. I have no problem going to Crossroads if there was anything there to see, shop or do. I am only pointing out why numerous people will not shop there.

The mall is almost dead and will be shortly. You can keep telling everyone how great, safe and gang free Crossroads is but there is no stopping the eventual closing. In retail perception is everything. The perception of Crossroads is a gang infested haven with no major retail shops. I havent checked lately but does it have a major anchor to attract foot traffic? You remind me of the former Iraqi information minister. "There is no gang problem. There are lots of great anchor type places to shop." I bet I keep hearing that from you on this forum as the wrecking ball is smashing through it.

Nope no major anchors It's pretty sad when Crossroads mall highway sign has the list for anchors and it says:


Waldenbooks
Bath & Body Works
Pac Sun
AMC*

* Not even in the mall.


Now what does Crossroads have that I can't get at Quail Springs or Penn Square?


Answer Nothing anymore.

I havent checked lately but....


Just the knowlegable person we need advising people about what's happening currently at Crossroad's.............................
NOT!!!

:bright_id Why don't you try being an expert on something you actually know something about?




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