# Civic Matters > Suburban & Other OK Communities > Norman >  Bruce Goff-designed Bavinger House has been demolished

## George

Does anyone know anything more about this?  Unbelievable architectural loss.

For what is known so far, see Oklahoma Modern blog:
http://www.oklahomamodern.us/2011/06...s-no-more.html

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## George

Just saw on FaceBook that someone went down to explore and, based on what they could see, it looked like the Bavinger house was still standing.  Strange goings on, but really hope the house is still standing.  Looking forward to someone getting to the bottom of all this.

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## jmarkross

A marvelous place. Spent summers swimming in their pool--shared with my friends, the Wilsons--(the pool was between the two houses) who lived next door and their homes were connected by a causeway. _Circa 1961-62...hope both houses are still there...lots of big green glass chunks embedded in the sandstone walls to let light through in the daytime...innovative._

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## Bunty

Last summer, I paid $10 for a tour of the Bavinger house, hosted by the son of the original owner.  He pointed out the colorful tiled floor in the bathroom he said he designed while a child.  The house is so odd and unique it's hard to describe it inside and outside.  To slightly do it justice, it's kinda like a cave with pods. At any rate, it's meant to fit in with nature, because much of it is a part of nature.  It's in a somewhat deteriorated condition, so for a unique experience don't put off seeing it.  As I understand it, the $10 is supposed to help fund its renovation.

While in Norman, don't pass up the marvelous Fred Jones Jr. Museum of Art.  They may still have a room with nothing but the artwork of Bruce Goff on display, along with scale models of some of his architectural wonders, including the Bavenger house.  Elsewhere in the museum, they have art of other authors so priceless that it's under guard at all times.

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## jmarkross

*Another Architectural Wonder from the avante-garde days of Normania...*

http://blog.ounodesign.com/2009/03/1...ulius-shulman/

_Your tour must have been hosted by Bill Bavinger..._

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## ljbab728

> *Another Architectural Wonder from the avante-garde days of Normania...*
> 
> http://blog.ounodesign.com/2009/03/1...ulius-shulman/
> 
> _Your tour must have been hosted by Bill Bavinger..._


I'm not surprised you mentioned Bill.  He was one of my classmates at Norman High.  The article mentions Bob Bavinger though.  I didn't  know him.

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## kbsooner

news 9 had a story, on the 10 oclock.  Sent a team to investigate.  Got to the gate, someone shouted at them from the grounds and fired a waring shot!  Police were called and couldn't find anyone, this could get interesting....

http://www.news9.com/story/14952275/...clipId=5978502

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## BDK

http://okc.net/?p=508

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## jmarkross

> http://okc.net/?p=508


This website shows the *embedded green glass* that let light into the internal areas--a smart idea--and thick enough not to need insulation.

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## USG'60

This is a travisty.  I really can't blame Bob for being deeply depressed by the lack of support from the archtectural community to help with rehabilitation, and I wonder if he would be willing to sell it to others willing to invest in it.  It would be awfully difficult to determine a "fair" price but something or someone will "have to give."  Pray for the Bavinger House, ya'll.

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## jmarkross

> This is a travisty.  I really can't blame Bob for being deeply depressed by the lack of support from the archtectural community to help with rehabilitation, and I wonder if he would be willing to sell it to others willing to invest in it.  It would be awfully difficult to determine a "fair" price but something or someone will "have to give."  Pray for the Bavinger House, ya'll.


The City of Norman should buy it and restore it--*it is that important*--and _they have gotten a lot of "good press" over the years because of it...._

_Of course--one would need to know the asking price..._all that glitters is not gold...

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## George

> http://okc.net/?p=508


BDK, thanks for posting the link.  Lynne provides great background on the Bavinger House, inlcuding what is known (and not known) about the current situation there.

Here's the title & byline for the above link:

*Masterpiece in Peril: Bruce Goffs Bavinger House
June 22, 2011
By Lynne Rostochil*

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## USG'60

I wonder if the Kebyar Society knows about this yet.  It is a society of organic architects who were influenced by Goff and they make a big issue about it.  Among them is Bart Prince, a MAJOR west coast architect.  They could easily buy that sucker and rehab it.  Maybe give it to Norman or OU to maintain for the long haul.  Hey, I'm grasping at straws in desperation.

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## jmarkross

> I wonder if the Kebyar Society knows about this yet.  It is a society of organic architects who were influenced by Goff and they make a big issue about it.  Among them is Bart Prince, a MAJOR west coast architect.  They could easily buy that sucker and rehab it.  Maybe give it to Norman or OU to maintain for the long haul.  Hey, I'm grasping at straws in desperation.


You are a erudite and decent fellow. *Spend some internet time and see what you can do.* It may become your legacy...

_Don't just stick a bumper sticker on the car..._
Get some students at the _Oklahoma Daily_ to help...

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## USG'60

I'll get on it like stink on a junebug (or some other mixed metaphor).  Actually there are BOUND to be people with built-in influence in a better position than I to start the rescue.  I think I will at least email Kebyar to make sure they know, but I am figuring that Bart Prince already knows since he was a very close ally of Goff's in his later years and even finished the LA museum when he died.  I'll let ya know if they respond.

Edit:  I did it so now I'll just wait and see.

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## jmarkross

> I'll get on it like stink on a junebug (or some other mixed metaphor).  Actually there are BOUND to be people with built-in influence in a better position than I to start the rescue.  I think I will at least email Kebyar to make sure they know, but I am figuring that Bart Prince already knows since he was a very close ally of Goff's in his later years and even finished the LA museum when he died.  I'll let ya know if they respond.
> 
> Edit:  I did it so now I'll just wait and see.


10-4

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## USG'60

Just heard back from Friends of Kebyar (The real name of the society) and it is sad news.  Here is the response:

Bruce,

Here is a copy of the last e-mail I got on the state of the house.  I guess the roof and other things supported by the central pipe is down. 

It is sad to see it go.  It is the best design Goff got built in my opinion.   Like a flower it has bloomed and now has faded and has past.  It gave us all great pleasure while it was in full bloom.  The future is up to the living.  

Thanks for your note.  What are you doing these days.  I have one design project I am working on here in Maine but it probably will not go into construction for a few years. 

James

James Walter Schildroth, Architect
Wiscasset, Maine 04578-0275

Visit my web site: 
http://www.schildrotharchitect.com
----------------------------------------------------

FOK Board,

I just got this photo showing the top of the central pipe support leaning severely to the side.  No cables are evident.  This was taken by Shane Hood, a preservation architecturally educated, though not registered, individual from Tulsa who went to see the house today.  He tried to get better photos but was physically restrained from doing so by Bob and Boz Bavinger.

The stone walls remain which may lead some people to think that the house still stands.  Without the cable support the roof and suspended pods are on the ground.

A local TV station learned of the situation and went out to investigate.  I learned that they were on public property and shots were fired.  Subsequently, the Norman police visited and did not see anything wrong, only the normal disrepair.  They did not know what the house should have been like.

The story of the TV crew attempt to visit the house was the lead story on Oklahoma channel 9 this evening.

Nelson


Nelson Brackin
Architect
PO Box 550904
Atlanta, GA  30355
www.nelsonbrackinarchitect.com

nelson.brackin@gmail.com
404-358-3241

Begin forwarded message:
> Shane Hood was just there and says that the top part of the spire has toppled over, which likely damaged the inside, too.  Here's a photo he took:
(The picture included is the same as the beginning of the thread.

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## okcisok

Isn't the "Teepee Church" on NW 178th and MacArthur a structure built by Bruce Goff?  I believe it was the Hopewell Baptist Church at the time of construction.  What is becoming of it?

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## blangtang

shootin at Gan Mathews and restraining an architect from taking photos...Bob dude sounds totally aggro

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## jmarkross

Looks like the Bavinger House was left to disrepair and is now falling apart. A testimony to neglect--and perhaps it was a structure too needy of expensive repairs and not really viable for selling. The Wilson home--which was connected by the causeway, had rooms without walls....which is to say the bedrooms were in alcoves without a full wall setting them off. Privacy was provided by design--not walls--and for a family it worked great. One bedroom had a balcony where oldest son (a swimmer) could dive into the pool right from his bedroom. Such a cool home. But, perhaps in today's world, heating and cooling such structures is not an option for any reasonable situation. Sad. They were lovely places--out in the woods...even had a rotating dining room table, the center of it--which was great! No need to pass the mashed potatoes...just turn the table!

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## jmarkross

> shootin at Gan Mathews and restraining an architect from taking photos...Bob dude sounds totally aggro


Must be some emotional problems going on. Gan is an old Norman guy...knows those folks and they know him.

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## USG'60

> Isn't the "Teepee Church" on NW 178th and MacArthur a structure built by Bruce Goff?  I believe it was the Hopewell Baptist Church at the time of construction.  What is becoming of it?


Last I heard it was being allowed to rot.  It is one of my least favorite Goff structures, so even thought I regret it I don't consider it a huge loss.  I do hope that it is rehabed someday even if for a new purpose.

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## BG918

> The Wilson home--which was connected by the causeway, had rooms without walls....which is to say the bedrooms were in alcoves without a full wall setting them off. Privacy was provided by design--not walls--and for a family it worked great. One bedroom had a balcony where oldest son (a swimmer) could dive into the pool right from his bedroom. Such a cool home. But, perhaps in today's world, heating and cooling such structures is not an option for any reasonable situation.


The Wilson house is being restored, albeit slowly, by a Norman resident.  I've been in since they've been working on it and it's an awesome house.  Very unique and beautiful.  The owner has made some changes but kept most of Goff's design intact.  One of the major changes was turning the old porte a cochere into a bedroom.  The old swimming pool, which reverted back to nature during years of neglect, will stay a natural pond with water lilies and resident turtles and frogs.  The whole property is surrounded by a bamboo forest.

This house is just south of Bavinger.

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## jmarkross

> The Wilson house is being restored, albeit slowly, by a Norman resident.  I've been in since they've been working on it and it's an awesome house.  Very unique and beautiful.  The owner has made some changes but kept most of Goff's design intact.  One of the major changes was turning the old porte a cochere into a bedroom.  The old swimming pool, which reverted back to nature during years of neglect, will stay a natural pond with water lilies and resident turtles and frogs.  The whole property is surrounded by a bamboo forest.
> 
> This house is just south of Bavinger.


Glad to hear this...I always thought it was better than Bavinger's home anyway--less obtuse. _Do you know if it is being restored by a family member?...it would be so great if it was._ There are a couple of them in the Norman area, I believe.

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## USG'60

> The Wilson house is being restored, albeit slowly, by a Norman resident.  I've been in since they've been working on it and it's an awesome house.  Very unique and beautiful.  The owner has made some changes but kept most of Goff's design intact.  One of the major changes was turning the old porte a cochere into a bedroom.  The old swimming pool, which reverted back to nature during years of neglect, will stay a natural pond with water lilies and resident turtles and frogs.  The whole property is surrounded by a bamboo forest.
> 
> This house is just south of Bavinger.


Is it still north of Alameda or is it south?  I've never seen it in real life.  By the way, what is it usually referred to in the literature?

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## foodiefan

Ugh... hate this seems to be happening.  A few years back (3-4), the Oklahoma City Miuseum of Art did a trip to MCM buildings in the greater metro.  The Bavinger House was one of the stops.  This was just about the time the restoration efforts were starting. . . I remember a pamphlet that had some information on the foundation that was being established to do the restoration.  Although it was pretty "down-at-the heels",  it was such an incredible place it literally took your breath away when you walked in.  A tragic, tragic loss if it is gone.

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## jmarkross

*FYI--for anyone who might be unfamiliar with this place...*

http://www.thebavingerhouse.org/phot...%20gallery.htm

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## foodiefan

interesting (to me at least) is that the house seemed to be much more "liveable" that what one gets from the pictures.  Not "traditional" in any sense, but more like "camping" with ammenities!!

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## jmarkross

> interesting (to me at least) is that the house seemed to be much more "liveable" that what one gets from the pictures.  Not "traditional" in any sense, but more like "camping" with ammenities!!


I always thought the Wilson home was much nicer and more livable--and the Bavinger house was more like a pointy shrine across the yard...

*It will be saved...the walls are extremely stout...the roof may be problematic--but the structure could always be restored...*

The Wilson home had a* big aquarium embedded in the sandstone wall that was marvelous...*

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## USG'60

Mark, darn it, the house that historians call the Wison house is in LA or somewhere, not in Norman.  ExACTly where is the one you are calling that and are there pictures available?  I don't find any and I always thought of myself as a Bruce Goff freak.

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## jmarkross

> Mark, darn it, the house that historians call the Wison house is in LA or somewhere, not in Norman.  ExACTly where is the one you are calling that and are there pictures available?  I don't find any and I always thought of myself as a Bruce Goff freak.


The home where the Wilson family lived--*I dated there daughter way, way back when*...was across from the Bavinger House...they were both on either side of the round common pool--which was large and concrete, but not sunken in the ground--a free-standing structure. There was a catwalk causeway that connected the two homes...*the guys were great friends and the houses were built together for some reason...*

*I am the one who calls it the Wilson home--because that is the name of the family that built it...*

_See entry #23 on this thread_

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## USG'60

I guess that is what I thought was the studio.  Do you have a link to a picture of it so I can be sure.

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## jmarkross

> I guess that is what I thought was the studio.  Do you have a link to a picture of it so I can be sure.


I don't have any pictures...they are all of Bavinger because it looks like a spire...Wilson home was not a pointy thing--but shared the same type of sandstone rock wall with big green glass chunks...they appeared like a single estate at the time...but they were separate...I would LOVE a picture of the home...*it holds many, many great memories from my early teenage years...*

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## USG'60

I'm sorry, what I meant is, have you ever seen a picture of the B house that included the W house on the internet and if so you can download one and link me to it.  I'm know what you REALLY mean, though, is that you would like pics of the parts and angles of it that were meaningful to you specifically.

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## jmarkross

> I'm sorry, what I meant is, have you ever seen a picture of the B house that included the W house on the internet and if so you can download one and link me to it.  I'm know what you REALLY mean, though, is that you would like pics of the parts and angles of it that were meaningful to you specifically.


I am going to try to home in on it on Google Earth...is is just south of Robinson...have to remember the N-S cross street

*UPDATE*

*Google Earth 730 60th Avenue NE, Norman, OK and you can see it nicely from the air...the Bavinger house is at the top of the frame...Wilson house is the one with the pool right up next to it, lower on the frame...enjoy!*

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## USG'60

Thanks, that was fun.

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## jmarkross

> Thanks, that was fun.


_Closer to town that you thought..eh?_

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## BG918

> Glad to hear this...I always thought it was better than Bavinger's home anyway--less obtuse. _Do you know if it is being restored by a family member?...it would be so great if it was._ There are a couple of them in the Norman area, I believe.


No, just a Norman resident that bought it several years ago when it was literally falling apart.  It's a beautiful house with the swimming pool in the front (really the back) of the house, which now is a "natural" pond with a wooden deck all around it.  

It's just south of Bavinger, off 60th.  Probably one of the most unique homes in Norman, along with Goff's other creations Bavinger and Ledbetter.

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## Dekoung

I have a journal produced in 2006 by Friends of Kebyar titled Bruce Goff Oklahoma Guide and it has color photos, directional maps, and descriptions of all Goff built, unbuilt, and lost structures.  I do not see a Goff house anywhere near the Bavinger house.  There are two on Timberdell, one on Woodland, the Ledbetter on Brooks, and the Bavinger and that is it.  This is a very complete catalogue and I am curious as to why the "Wilson" house is not included in any of the three categories.

I attended the Norman portion of the Goff Centennial in 2004 and joined Friends of Kebyar and thus received this journal when it was published.  I still wear my Goff Centennial tshirt to the gym.

I just got out my Goff Norman 2004 material and on the Norman tour Bill Wilson is listed as the architect of the Wilson house and it was not on on the tour.  He must have been a Goff disciple as other houses listed were by Vollendorf, Boggs, Arne Henderson,Blaine Imel,William Burgett, and Herb Greene(Prairie Chicken).

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## jmarkross

> I have a journal produced in 2006 by Friends of Kebyar titled Bruce Goff Oklahoma Guide and it has color photos, directional maps, and descriptions of all Goff built, unbuilt, and lost structures.  I do not see a Goff house anywhere near the Bavinger house.  There are two on Timberdell, one on Woodland, the Ledbetter on Brooks, and the Bavinger and that is it.  This is a very complete catalogue and I am curious as to why the "Wilson" house is not included in any of the three categories.
> 
> I attended the Norman portion of the Goff Centennial in 2004 and joined Friends of Kebyar and thus received this journal when it was published.  I still wear my Goff Centennial tshirt to the gym.
> 
> I just got out my Goff Norman 2004 material and on the Norman tour Bill Wilson is listed as the architect of the Wilson house and it was not on on the tour.  He must have been a Goff disciple as other houses listed were by Vollendorf, Boggs, Arne Henderson,Blaine Imel,William Burgett, and Herb Greene(Prairie Chicken).


I believe Mr. Wilson was an architect as well...I think they were all associated together--business-wise, back in the day...hence building their homes adjacent_...friends enough to share the pool and have a causeway that connected the two homes back then..._

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## MikeOKC

Here's a link to a site working on the restoration of the Goff designed Hopewell Church:
http://www.goff-hopewell.org

Hopewell is also listed on Preservation Oklahoma's *"2011: Oklahoma's Most Endangered Historic Sites."*

Hopewell at Abandoned Oklahoma:
http://www.abandonedok.com/hopewell-baptist-church/

http://www.narrowlarry.com/nlgoff-hopewell.html

Just found this, too. Interesting. 
http://www.pbase.com/camdraw/goff

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## BG918

> I have a journal produced in 2006 by Friends of Kebyar titled Bruce Goff Oklahoma Guide and it has color photos, directional maps, and descriptions of all Goff built, unbuilt, and lost structures.  I do not see a Goff house anywhere near the Bavinger house.  There are two on Timberdell, one on Woodland, the Ledbetter on Brooks, and the Bavinger and that is it.  This is a very complete catalogue and I am curious as to why the "Wilson" house is not included in any of the three categories.
> 
> I attended the Norman portion of the Goff Centennial in 2004 and joined Friends of Kebyar and thus received this journal when it was published.  I still wear my Goff Centennial tshirt to the gym.
> 
> I just got out my Goff Norman 2004 material and on the Norman tour Bill Wilson is listed as the architect of the Wilson house and it was not on on the tour.  He must have been a Goff disciple as other houses listed were by Vollendorf, Boggs, Arne Henderson,Blaine Imel,William Burgett, and Herb Greene(Prairie Chicken).


Wilson may be credited with designing the house south of Bavinger, but one step into that house and you can see that Goff had a major influence.  Similar to how Goff is not credited with designing Tulsa's Boston Ave Methodist Church even though he worked closely with Adah Robinson on the design as a kid.

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## USG'60

I read a few years ago that he was finally being officially credited for the design of Boston Ave MC by the church and the archtectural community of Tulsa.  Maybe I dreamed it, anyone know for sure?

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## BG918

> I read a few years ago that he was finally being officially credited for the design of Boston Ave MC by the church and the archtectural community of Tulsa.  Maybe I dreamed it, anyone know for sure?


I haven't heard that.  Boston Ave is an amazing building.  If you've never been you have to go check it out, and especially take a tour of the interior including the top of the tower.

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## USG'60

I have done 2 photo shoots of it over many years, but never with a digital camera.  Someday I'll return to shoot yet again and I will try to get "the tour."  It is nearly my favorite structure on the entire earth.

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## Dustin



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## jmarkross

> 


A great video and animation. I could not help but wonder--watching it...*that place would be a nightmare (literally and financially) to heat and cool today...*

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## Bunty

Now decades later a great deal of vegetation has been allowed to grow around the structure as evidenced by the picture below I took of it while on a very fascinating tour conducted by Bavenger's son last summer.  He apparently lives in a dome like home near the structure. (Maybe it's more livable.)  A request to walk across the bridge was declined.  I bet the lowest level wasn't that bad to keep comfortable year round.  But I would have to agree, the upper levels must have been quite a challenge.  It was kinda hot inside since Bavenger apparently never turned on the air conditioning except when guests showed up for a tour.  

Old architectural wonders like this are like old rock stars still on the road.  You better see them while you can before they finally break down or permanently retire.

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## Bunty

With so many rich people in the country I don't understand why none seem interested in stepping forward to help provide funding for the restoration of the Bavenger House.  Maybe there's such a thing as rich bigots who don't like it because Goff was apparently a homosexual.  Anyway, if I had many millions in the bank, I would easily spring forth for the opportunity to help restore it.

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## USG'60

Me too, Bunt.  

Surely there is some new info on this.  Has Bob allowed anyone in yet?  Is he going out in public?  Are there any photos other than through the trees between the house and the road?  I wish we had a member of the OU school of Arch on the forum.  Can one of our Norman members find out some more for us.

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## Bunty

So I wonder if the Bavenger House was insured against storm damage?

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## ljbab728

I recently emailed this website to give them information about what is happening with the Bavinger House and asked if they had any suggestions.

http://www.oldhouses.com/

This is the response I received:

"Hi ljbab728,

Thank you for your interest in our site.  I have looked over both the
website and the article link you sent me, and unfortunately I'm not sure
which organization you would need to contact.  From what I understand, the
home is still owned by private owners.  This means they would have to reach
out to various organizations if they want to restore the home.  Have you
tried contacting the National Preservation Society?  They may have more
resources available to them than I do.  In the articles I have read, the
local Historic Society is well aware that the house needs repairs, but they
seem to be at the mercy of the original owner's son.  If he wants to destroy
the house, the only saving grace would be to have a preservation group
purchase the house from him and then restore it.

I am sorry I could not be of more assistance.  It really would be a shame to
lose such an integral part of our architectural history.  Please let me know
if there is anything further I can do.

Best Regards, 


Starla R. Abernathy
Oldhouses.com"

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## RadicalModerate

Sort of reads like the auto-response from "The Offices of Tom Coburn, Senator, Oklahoma, and Washington DC" that I got back regarding what I perceived--on behalf of my customers--to be the unfairness of not extending the Home Improvement Tax Credits at least to a point where the Tax-Credited stuff could actually "be installed" . . .

Have you tried WGBH/Boston/This Old House or perhaps a Canadian Broadcasting Company?
I'd bet "Holmes on Homes" would have a thing or two to say . . .
But after that, he would fix it all up in thirty minutes--maybe an hour . . . For free!!

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## George

More news on the Bavinger House.  Not good.

http://okc.net/2011/12/05/bavinger-house-is-history/

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## foodiefan

> More news on the Bavinger House.  Not good.
> 
> http://okc.net/2011/12/05/bavinger-house-is-history/


That is incredibly sad.  The Oklahoma City Museum of Art did a "Mid Century Modern" tour a few years back with Bob Blackburn. . .several stops in the City and the Bavinger House.  It wasn't in good shape then, but I'm glad I got to see it before it took its last breath.

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