# Civic Matters > Suburban & Other OK Communities > Moore >  Target

## soonerwatcher

Not sure if this web site has been posted. It really doesn't add much more to what we already know, I just found it interesting.

Direct Development | Commercial Retail Developer

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## Zoom Zoom

Awesome! Moore could definitely use a target.

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## Jesseda

wow moore is getting so many sq ft of retail 19th is going to be a million plus sq feet of shopping maybe even 2 million one riverwalk is done and royal rock

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## MrZ

Wasn't work supposed to start already for redesigning 19th street? or am I confused? Adding so much new space without working on the traffic problem is going to make a bad situation into a nightmare.

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## Jesseda

19th street is getting work done sometime this year on the bridge, its starting to get pointless why not add 3 lanes on ea side all the way from santa fe to broadway, instead of doing just the minimum to relieve traffic flow ea. time.. 19th is already a large shoppin district, with 2-3 more large shopping centers planned and more restaurants its going to be hell with traffic, it is already a pain as it is!!

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## Jesseda

does anyone know for sure when this will be built?

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## scootinger

Actually, the same developer is/was planning on building a big-box center in Stillwater with a Target store. The site used to say "Target" but now it just says "Anchor"...interestingly the plans for both the Moore and Stillwater stores show 133,041 square feet exact. Although I'm not a big fan of big-box centers  being built everywhere, as an OSU student I was somewhat looking forward to possibly having a Target store in Stillwater. Anyone know much about this developer?

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## Chase

Same developer building the SuperTarget in south Tulsa that is under construction now.  They build good stuff.  Mostly in Texas, though.

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## flintysooner

> does anyone know for sure when this will be built?


It all depends on Target and the economy.  

In the earnings call of 1/31/2009 Douglas A. Scovanner, Target CFO, stated _"...we’ve been very deliberate in the management and application of our cash resources in the current environment. We continue to evaluate and underwrite proposed new store projects one at a time, and over the past several months we have committed to only a small handful of new stores entering our new store pipeline.

Lead times in this arena are such that our March and July opening cycles in 2009 will look similar to historic patterns of growth, but we will begin to taper off sharply in the fall of 2009 and well into 2010. While there isn’t a lot of visibility into 2010 at the moment, a rough range of total new store possibilities would be framed by, say, five stores on the low end and perhaps 30 on the top end."_

(I added underlining to emphasize my key points)

So in all of 2010 only 5 to 30 stores are going to be opened and there is not even a projected planning number for 2011.  Target opens stores in March, July, and before Christmas.  It takes about a year to build a store.  So if there were going to be any March, 2010 openings they would be just now setting those in place.  More likely there will be nothing opened until July, 2010 and those few stores will not be determined until July or August this year.

The other big thing to notice is that proposed projects are being evaluated one at a time.  This means that the Stillwater store or the Moore store are competing with other proposed projects all over the United States.  Each store creates about 150 new jobs and generates significant sales tax revenue.  This makes for very fierce competition between communities.  This is especially true in areas hard hit by unemployment.

In that regard the City of Moore put together a very good package.  The thing is one just does not know what other communities are doing now that things have deteriorated so much.

In addition to that there are fewer projects for approved Target developers to undertake which increases competition for the few projects that will be started.  Since developers usually underwrite a substantial part of the development cost for the Target portion this adds another important element to the mix.

This particular developer certainly has a good reputation with Target so that helps tremendously.  But there are other very good developers out there with projects of their own and for some this is about survival.

Another issue for the developer is whether or not the portion adjacent to Target can be profitably built and leased.  That's on top of financing issues of course.

In other parts of the call Target states that they will generate sufficient cash flow to handle the expansion plans underway as well as debt obligations, losses from credit cards, and so on.

And Steinhafel, Taget's CEO, states that if the economy shows signs of improvement they can move aggressively.

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## mrbubba81

I kind of hope we don't get a Target.  19th St. is such a cluster already. Norman is not that far away.

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## Bobby821

> I kind of hope we don't get a Target.  19th St. is such a cluster already. Norman is not that far away.


It is not either, The land on 19th street is already ruined anyway might as well build more crap on it. I miss the wide open spaces that used to be in Moore.

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## mrbubba81

:Iagree: 




> I miss the wide open spaces that used to be in Moore.


Amen.

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## oneforone

I miss the days when people did something constructive with their lives. These days It seems the only thing people want to do is complain about everything.

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## Charlie40

> I miss the days when people did something constructive with their lives. These days It seems the only thing people want to do is complain about everything.


I agree

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## Easy180

> I kind of hope we don't get a Target.  19th St. is such a cluster already. Norman is not that far away.


About a half hour drive from Moore right now with all the construction fun

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## Chase

There really is not a ton of distance between Moore and Norman.  I can see the Toys R Us closing in Norman after the Moore location opens.  The 2 communities are battling for the same retail.

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## Jesseda

i can see the crossroads one closing before the norman one

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## Charlie40

I hate to see the one at Crossroads close but That to me would be the most likely cadidate for closure.

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## Chase

I heard it will probably be a "double relocation", meaning both Crossroads and Norman will relocate to Moore.  There just isn't enough population to justify 3 stores that close together.

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## Jesseda

well there is a bed bath and beyond in norman same with 3 petsmarts on south side metro now. why cant there be 2 toy stores on south metro? we can support 2 bed bath and beyonds one in moore other in norman?

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## mrbubba81

> i can see the crossroads one closing before the norman one


Wouldn't hurt my feelings!  I feel unsafe walking in that place!  :Fighting32:

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## Chase

Toys R Us looks for more population than Bed Bath and Beyond and PetSmart.

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## Jesseda

we need something other than a toyrrus and walmart to get our kids toys, i wish a fao schwartz or disney store or some kind of large toy store other than the common ones would built in south okc metro.. I still cant seethe norman one closing because its to nice and new still

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## megax11

With Toys R Us renovating the inside of Crossroads, I doubt they would close that location.

I honestly think that TRU can survive having three locations.

Oh well, being a southsider, any business that has gotten money from southsiders, just to up and run away from them, won't be getting my business anymore.

No reason to help other towns get money while the city I live in gets abandoned, so they can grow high and mighty and feed the ego's of the residents there.

I right now, refuse to eat at Chic-fil-A because they won't build one on southside, outside of the mall, where they might close... I have supported them once a week, sometimes even three times a week, only to hear they might close up with no southside unit in the cards.

I would laugh if others on southside stopped supporting the stores they supported, only for those stores to stop supporting them by making them drive a fair ways away just to shop or eat at said business.

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## russellc

Those stores on the southside have been supported for decades by people from Moore and elsewhere.  Can we get our tax dollars back?

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## SoonerDave

> I right now, refuse to eat at Chic-fil-A because they won't build one on southside, outside of the mall, where they might close... I have supported them once a week, sometimes even three times a week, only to hear they might close up with no southside unit in the cards.


Chick-Fil-A has closed on the sale of the old Steak and Ale property on I-240 and Western, per another thread on this board. Presume the next step is to get permits to tear down the old building.




> We don't need Toys R Us....we need...an FAOSchwartz....


Sorry, but Toys R Us bought out a failing FAOSchwartz if I'm not mistaken.

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## Jesseda

yep sooner dave i noticed that in the paper a week or so ago, sad  :Frown:  hopefuly toys r us  opens up so theme stores like fao

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