# OKCpedia > General Real Estate Topics >  Is it time to replace Arrow to Atoms Space Tower?

## Laramie

Many of our iconic structures at Fair Park are gone:
 . . . 
*The Monorail* * The Grand Stands . . . . . . .*
Are there any new developments on the status of the Arrows to Atoms Space Tower which was being repaired?

Is it time to build a new 'Arrow to Atoms Space Tower?'   Something more iconic; higher than the current structure--as a centerpiece of the Oklahoma State Fair and another landmark for Oklahoma City.




*Seattle Space Needle 605 (feet high)* . . . . . . . . *Dallas Reunion Tower (520 feet)* . . . .  *S.A.Tower of Americas (622 feet)* . . *Las Vegas Stratosphere (1,149 feet)*

*Should we rebuild the Arrows to Atoms Space Tower; if so, how high?*

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## Plutonic Panda

Let's make one 1,500 ft. tall and add something unique like a model rocket shoot off or weather balloon launch at the top where people who pay for it can watch their rocket or balloon via camera in real time. Add a world class restaurant; call it Crown Atlas or something cool and have people eating on glass tables, sitting on glass chairs, eating from glass plates and such. Build perhaps the worlds tallest "drop elevator" for thrills that opens during the state fair only. Sort of like the superman in Dallas where it takes you to the top and then you free-fall.

Let's get the monorail back online and replace all the surface parking and create a mini new-urbanist community with parking garages(to supply parking to fair) and mixed retail and housing to bring life to the state fair year-round. Bring formula 1 racing here and build a new track that puts OKC on the map for world class race tracks. We already have an awesome arena there not to mention a new expo center that could easily have the exterior changed if it is so bland.

You get right into a parking garage and jump right into monorail that is 5-7 stories up and it drops you right into any spot in the fair you want to be. Put ticket booths outside the monorail stations... this would be amazing.

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## Plutonic Panda

Also that farm exhibit they have at the state fair grounds during the state fair, they ought to create a full time museum in Stock Yards city showcasing a classic American Farm Museum featuring interactive exhibits, live animals, a walk-through bee exhibit allowing to dress in bee suits and walking into a large scale beehive with thousands perhaps millions of bees and showing the process of life-stages of chicks, calfs, turkeys, etc. Show them hatching from their eggs etc.

It would also be neat to have about 3-5 25-40 story vertical farms giving an official skyline. That would be awesome. Let Oklahoma be a leader in vertical farming.

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## Easy180

Ed just called and said no to all of these ideas  :Cool:

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## Laramie

> Ed just called and said no to all of these ideas


Take it Easy while LMAO...


A "no" vote would be an idea for Ed.   I have a few suggestions for what Ed can do... 

* "Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.*

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## Just the facts

I don't know about replacing it but I think it would be pretty cool to have something similar in Bricktown.

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## mugofbeer

How about a 1000 foot oil/gas derrick?

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## Joe Kimball

I'd love to see it repaired. It's scaled nicely to the size of the area.

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## catch22

> How about a 1000 foot oil/gas derrick?


I would rather we embrace our heritage a little bit more in depth than oil. A giant Indian arrow would be a good start.

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## Plutonic Panda

> I would rather we embrace our heritage a little bit more in depth than oil. A giant Indian arrow would be a good start.


HA! I was almost about to suggest that, but then I thought maybe not as some of my other ideas were a bit radical lol..... I do like that idea though. I think that would be cooler than an huge oil derrick.

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## ljbab728

> I would rather we embrace our heritage a little bit more in depth than oil. A giant Indian arrow would be a good start.


I think that comment was a tongue in check reference to a previous proposal to put a 1000 foot oil derrick monument spanning the river downtown.

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## Laramie

> I think that comment was a tongue in check reference to a previous proposal to put a 1000 foot oil derrick monument spanning the river downtown.


Rob McClendon (OETA) did a show on Oklahoma Horizon some years ago on an oil derrick type structure on the Oklahoma River taller than the Eiffel Tower.

* "Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.*

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## metro

I was thinking the same thing the other day. I usually drive by fairgrounds daily, and that stupid Space Needle looks extremely dated, and blighted. The City either needs to repair or replace it. Demolishing it and leaving nothing should not be an option. Our fairgrounds are UGLY, and they need some dressing up. Some sort of iconic landmark, that doesn't look like the homemade kitchy craft days of the 50's and 60's would go a long way in our "Big League City Micky" image.

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## MWCGuy

I would not be surprised if the Fair Board's plan all along was to just let it sit and rot until the public thinks it's an eyesore and they are "forced" to tear it down. 

I miss it, the fair is just not the same without it. They have had plenty of time to complete upgrades or just flat out replace it. Texas put in a new one at their state fair. Then again they do need more parking for the horse trailers. Come to think of it that pit would be perfect for a horse trailer washout station.

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## tomokc

Mystery Tower at the Fairgrounds. You heard it here first.

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## CaptDave

> How about a 1000 foot oil/gas derrick?


A lot of people think we already have one lying across the new I40......

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## Laramie

"The sights and sounds of the State Fair of Oklahoma linger for years — even if some have faded into history...
..Sure enough, 2009 was a last shot at going up the Space Tower with its 360-degree views of the city. 

The ride has been closed since, with no word on when or if it will ever return."
Oklahoma State Fair: Some State Fair highlights now just a memory | News OK

* "Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.*

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## Bellaboo

Unless i'm really losing it, the Arrows to Atoms tower is still in the metro area. I visited a friend at his farm and when driving up to it, I think I saw it laying in a pasture. This was about 15 years ago, so it may not be there anymore. 

But if anyone wants to go check and see if it is still out there......take Cemetary Road (Garth Brooks Blvd) in Yukon south to 44th street. Go West for a couple of miles and if it's there, it'll be on the North side of the road.

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## tomokc

Why not buy Seattle's Space Needle, move it here, rename it, and then be accused of stealing it?

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## Bill Robertson

I've done quite a bit of contract electrical and general maintenance\construction work at the Fairgrounds since about 1977. I can't speak to how much in the way of funding the Fair Board has at it's disposal but I do know that the monorail needed replacement of parts every year. The parts were no longer available and had to be custom fabricated. VERY expensive! The needle is to that point now. I miss both of them as I was born in OKC in 1959 and grew up near the Fairgrounds. I also understand that it costs a small fortune to have machine shops constantly reproduce parts to keep obsolete things going. Especially for things that are only used two weeks per year.

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## Joe Kimball

> I've done quite a bit of contract electrical and general maintenance\construction work at the Fairgrounds since about 1977. I can't speak to how much in the way of funding the Fair Board has at it's disposal but I do know that the monorail needed replacement of parts every year. The parts were no longer available and had to be custom fabricated. VERY expensive! The needle is to that point now. I miss both of them as I was born in OKC in 1959 and grew up near the Fairgrounds. I also understand that it costs a small fortune to have machine shops constantly reproduce parts to keep obsolete things going. Especially for things that are only used two weeks per year.


THIS is what we need more of, here. Informed observations and opinion.

I can absolutely understand this. I don't suppose operating the tower ride, were it to be repaired of course, for more than two weeks a year to offset the cost would help matters?

EDIT: Of course, right after I hit the post button there's the question of staffing and what exactly there is to SEE at off periods.

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## Urbanized

I think the space needle could be leveraged as an attraction more often than just during the State Fair. The fairgrounds reportedly hosts 1000+ event days each year! many of which are targeted at families. I think with a bit of rework/upgrade it could pay for itself and then some.

By the way, last October while at the Texas State Fair for OU/Texas I rode the recently-added Top o' Texas tower, or whatever the call it, and it only reinforced my opinion that ours should be returned to operation.

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## UnclePete

I am thinking the Fairgrounds will be sold (or given) to private business in the near future.  Let those folks figure out what to do with the Arrows to Atoms tower.

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## Urbanized

Interesting theory. On what would you base such an idea?

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## Bellaboo

> I am thinking the Fairgrounds will be sold (or given) to private business in the near future.  *Let those folks figure out* *what to do with the Arrows to Atoms tower*.


Where is the Arrows to Atoms Tower ?

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## Bill Robertson

> Where is the Arrows to Atoms Tower ?


Just a bit north of the center of the fairgrounds.

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## Laramie

*<<<*This section (observation) of the tower has been removed; leaving this*>>>*

My understanding is that the operational apparatus of the Arrows to Atoms Space Tower is 10 feet below ground:

_"Officials say the operating system that sits 10 feet below the space tower is ruined..."_

Space Tower shut down for the fair | Community Spirit | North Oklahoma City News



* "Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.*

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## Bellaboo

> Just a bit north of the center of the fairgrounds.


Nope, that's the spiraling space needle from Switzerland. See my post # 18.

On post #1, it's the upper left picture.

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## Laramie

Brought back memories: Today's paper featured the Arrows to Atoms Space Tower.

*Space Tower still soars in fairgoers’ memories*
_Briggs, of Oklahoma City, spent part of her childhood in the Pacific Northwest, and the tower reminded her of Seattle's Space Needle. Now 44, Briggs thinks it's a shame that parents who remember the Space Tower from their childhoods can't take their children up in it today._

The Oklahoman

Fair Park has really invested in some decorative gates and fences. When will they invest in something like a new space tower, monorail or stadium?    Most of the iconic structures (Grand Stands stadium, monorail, space tower) are gone or inoperable.  It's time for something to go along with the proposed exhibition halls and upscale barns.

  Prep barn, barrel racing...
Proposed new $60 million exhibit hall that will 
include 225,000 square feet of exhibition space.    

*Gone, but not forgotten...*



 
Monorail, Grand Stands & 'Arrows to Atoms' Space Tower (Top center).

Let's replace the 330 ft., Arrows to Atoms Space Tower with a new iconic structure in the neighborhood of 700 plus feet.

*"Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.*

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## Plutonic Panda

Personally if it were me, I'd say just repaint it and rehabilitate it. Bring F1 racing by building a permanent track on a large portion of the parking lots and go with structured parking. Build a restaurant at the base of the tower that is open all year. Also reconstuct the monorail and connect it to the convention center and bring a large festival market place to the fair grounds that operates all year except holidays.

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## TheTravellers

I believe the article said it would cost hundreds of thousands of dollars to get it back into shape, and that was just for the control room.  Ain't no way they're going to spend that kind of money.  Now if we could get the "Bricktown Flyer" put there in its place.....

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## Bullbear

I hate that it is broken and will never be fixed. and that all iconic structures and attractions of the fairgrounds are gone. the airplanes, Monorail, Grandstands the space needle. the entire space no longer feels special. i'm sure much of that is because I am older but I miss those staples of the fair. I can remember when the Garden and flower building I think it was called was so cool inside with landscaped trails and a water fall. we would always go in to see my Grandmothers prize winning flowers of the year..

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## SoonerDave

> I hate that it is broken and will never be fixed. and that all iconic structures and attractions of the fairgrounds are gone. the airplanes, Monorail, Grandstands the space needle. the entire space no longer feels special. i'm sure much of that is because I am older but I miss those staples of the fair. I can remember when the Garden and flower building I think it was called was so cool inside with landscaped trails and a water fall. we would always go in to see my Grandmothers prize winning flowers of the year..


I think the "expense" of repairing the space needle is an absolute load of hogwash. If they *wanted* to, they could line up any one of a dozen corporate sponsors who would foot the bill for repairing it for multiple years of publicity/sponsorship.  Let's say it cost $250,000 to rehab. You think there aren't at least a dozen companies in the OKC area who couldn't foot that bill as a _promotional expense_ in exchange for their corporate name, logo, whatever to be splattered on the needle for the next, oh, decade or so? Or prime placement on Fair promotional materials? I am irrevocably convinced it could be done _if someone in power and influence wanted to do so badly enough._

The point is that no one running the fairgrounds GIVES A YOU-KNOW-WHAT about those "iconic structures." They just want more horse barns and floor space. I firmly believe that, eventually, they'll decide the fair itself isn't worth the hassle and shut it down for similarly manufactured reasons. Yeah, I'm cynical. But you don't plow down everything they've plowed down without the ulterior motive of converting the entire space to an entirely different purpose. 

Make no mistake - its my opinion that those "running" the fair CARE NOT ONE BAG OF BEANS ABOUT IT.  Period.

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## Bullbear

> I think the "expense" of repairing the space needle is an absolute load of hogwash. If they *wanted* to, they could line up any one of a dozen corporate sponsors who would foot the bill for repairing it for multiple years of publicity/sponsorship.  Let's say it cost $250,000 to rehab. You think there aren't at least a dozen companies in the OKC area who couldn't foot that bill as a _promotional expense_ in exchange for their corporate name, logo, whatever to be splattered on the needle for the next, oh, decade or so? Or prime placement on Fair promotional materials? I am irrevocably convinced it could be done _if someone in power and influence wanted to do so badly enough._
> 
> The point is that no one running the fairgrounds GIVES A YOU-KNOW-WHAT about those "iconic structures." They just want more horse barns and floor space. I firmly believe that, eventually, they'll decide the fair itself isn't worth the hassle and shut it down for similarly manufactured reasons. Yeah, I'm cynical. But you don't plow down everything they've plowed down without the ulterior motive of converting the entire space to an entirely different purpose. 
> 
> Make no mistake - its my opinion that those "running" the fair CARE NOT ONE BAG OF BEANS ABOUT IT.  Period.


I wish I didn't agree with you.. but i do.  I really hate seeing it fade

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## SOONER8693

> I think the "expense" of repairing the space needle is an absolute load of hogwash. If they *wanted* to, they could line up any one of a dozen corporate sponsors who would foot the bill for repairing it for multiple years of publicity/sponsorship.  Let's say it cost $250,000 to rehab. You think there aren't at least a dozen companies in the OKC area who couldn't foot that bill as a _promotional expense_ in exchange for their corporate name, logo, whatever to be splattered on the needle for the next, oh, decade or so? Or prime placement on Fair promotional materials? I am irrevocably convinced it could be done _if someone in power and influence wanted to do so badly enough._
> 
> The point is that no one running the fairgrounds GIVES A YOU-KNOW-WHAT about those "iconic structures." They just want more horse barns and floor space. I firmly believe that, eventually, they'll decide the fair itself isn't worth the hassle and shut it down for similarly manufactured reasons. Yeah, I'm cynical. But you don't plow down everything they've plowed down without the ulterior motive of converting the entire space to an entirely different purpose. 
> 
> Make no mistake - its my opinion that those "running" the fair CARE NOT ONE BAG OF BEANS ABOUT IT.  Period.


Agree 100%. It is very sad. Once a great state fair, now a joke.

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## yukong

> Agree 100%. It is very sad. Once a great state fair, now a joke.


It started when the Fair Board hired Skip Wagner to be manager of the fairgrounds.  He made the first major changes.  We hired him away from somewhere in Texas and he was more committed to the barnyards portion.  In fact, I remember the first fair after he took over.  It was a disaster as far as I was concerned.  Lots of venders dropped out and it was just poor.  We finally got rid of him and the new management seemed to be interested in bringing back the "old fair" feel.  But I agree that they now don't seem to care about what made the fair great.  The monorail, the space needle, and others.  I miss the big old mansion that was down by the garden building.  Every year that was our favorite thing to go through and see the different furnishings and how they kept changing it up.  I'm not opposed to the elimination of the travel and transportation and carriage buildings especially for a nicer newer one.  But why the grandstands?  I know the company line...but I miss that old girl.  But I know Devon, or Continental...shoot, the Chickasaw Nation, would donate all the money necessary to fix the space needle for their name emblazoned all over the car and up and down the needle.  And the good will it would generate for just getting it going.  It would be no trouble.  They could have done the same for the monorail.  Just aggravates me to no end to see all the good old stuff disappearing.

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## ljbab728

> I miss the big old mansion that was down by the garden building.  Every year that was our favorite thing to go through and see the different furnishings and how they kept changing it up.  I'm not opposed to the elimination of the travel and transportation and carriage buildings especially for a nicer newer one.


I enjoyed that also but I wouldn't call it a mansion.  It was just a very interesting older Oklahoma farmhouse.

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## zookeeper

It's sad about the Space Tower or "needle" as it was called for years. There was a duplicate by the same company at Marineland Of The Pacific, a legendary oceanarium in Los Angeles. Seaworld bought the park many years ago (1987) and just shut it down. It only wanted some of the aquarium attractions. It sat abandoned for years and they finally tore the Tower down in 1995. Here's a pic of the "other" tower in LA.

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## SoonerDave

I realize this is pure pipe dreaming, but hey, you never can tell..

I know that Steve Lackmeyer (sp) has had some problems here and has opted not to visit and/or contribute as frequently/at all for reasons that he, of course, is entirely entitled to have, but if he does lurk around here I wish/hope he might see this thread and get the notion there are lot of OKC residents who hate to see what's happened to the iconic aspect of the fairgrounds, and wishes something more than just horse barns and convention space were going in its place. Surely *someone* with *some* influence can do something to turn this tide before we lose the fair entirely - which I admit many fear we've already done. Some public discussion of this issue would be to everyone's benefit, especially if it made TPTB currently running the fair/fairgrounds just a bit uncomfortable. 

Mind you, this isn't about building new exhibit halls. Its about the unceremonious trashing of the unique aspects of the fairgrounds that made it distinctive, the history that's been trashed along with it, and a broader section of the public who are really, really tired of the public doublespeak rationalizations behind all of it. 

Here's an open call to Mayor Mick, whom I've supported in all his campaigns, to "get real" about the fairgrounds with the citizens who feel our history is being bulldozed for a horse barn. Hear us. Please. I don't really care how many millions in horse shows we have; I don't care about how many square feet of new concrete we're buying. I care about the persistent destruction of our fairgrounds. I care about the abject lack of interest in persisting a unique and distinctive fairgrounds area, and how I'd very much like to see those of us who *do* care get a say in inspiring its reinvigoration. It *can* be done. It absolutely *can* be done. It will *never* be done by those who have already concluded it is impossible. Those people should be removed from the process.

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## Urbanized

> I enjoyed that also but I wouldn't call it a mansion.  It was just a very interesting older Oklahoma farmhouse.


In all fairness, it was referred to as the Goodholm Mansion on signage and in reporting. It also never was on a farm; it was built at NW 4th and Walnut, in what we now think of as Deep Deuce/Flatiron.

It was moved to the fairgrounds in the eighties and removed in 2008, to a house moving company's yard in Nicoma Park, where it now sits eerily and forlornly on a hill overlooking NE 23rd. I spotted it by chance a few months ago on a motorcycle ride.

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## SoonerDave

> In all fairness, it was referred to as the Goodholm Mansion on signage and in reporting. It also never was on a farm; it was built at NW 4th and Walnut, in what we now think of as Deep Deuce/Flatiron.
> 
> It was moved to the fairgrounds in the eighties and removed in 2008, to a house moving company's yard in Nicoma Park, where it now sits eerily and forlornly on a hill overlooking NE 23rd. I spotted it by chance a few months ago on a motorcycle ride.


I can toss in a few more bits on this - the home was at least partially renovated (well, in the context of bringing it up to what was at least the idea of then-contemporary standards) by the local DAR, and they raised funds by offering tours during the fair for something like $5 a person to offset some of the expense. (My grandmother guided some of the tours one year). Obviously most of the DAR membership was median to older ladies, and the fact the home had no air conditioning meant they had to have lots of help guiding the tours because the house would get hot inside (very little breeze) and only took in a few folks at a time. They had quite a bit of volunteer labor to do some of the fixup work, and actually got the living room, kitchen, and rear area in very nice shape - more than adequate for their touring purposes. It proved too much, however. As I recall, they never had the money to fix up more than a portion of the house at a time, but due to the age of the house, as one part would be repaired, others would start to fall part. The upper floors were never opened for the tours due to the structural integrity of the first-floor ceiling, as well as the roof superstructure. I think the rate of deterioration just became too great to handle, and the DAR had to abandon it, sadly. And given the way fair management has changed over the years since that time, I rather doubt the place would have been welcome there much longer anyway. They've kicked out everything else novel and compelling  - no reason to think Goodholm would have been an exception.

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## SoonerDave

> It started when the Fair Board hired Skip Wagner to be manager of the fairgrounds.  He made the first major changes.  We hired him away from somewhere in Texas and he was more committed to the barnyards portion.  In fact, I remember the first fair after he took over.  It was a disaster as far as I was concerned.


BIngo. Wegner destroyed the fair. I will say, however, he was brought in by powers who wanted to "overhaul" the fair because it wasn't sufficiently cosmopolitan for their froufrou tastes. 

I'll never, ever forget the mayor at that time - think it was Humphries - was quoted in the paper as wanting to "do something" about the Fair's "funnel cake and corn dog image." 

The elitism just reeked. And the height of the asininity was when they literally set up a "tea room" in the middle of what was the old International building (arched roof). It was obvious that the leaders were, and largely are, clueless and disinterested. 

That was the catalyst that started the ball rolling, and rolling right over the fairgrounds to nothing more than a pile of horse barns and conventioneer space.

I will say, however, that at least some folks - myself included - were angry enough about what was being done to at least write letters to the paper AND every member of the city council AND the mayor to express their frustration. Heck, one of my letters was read on the air by Mike McCarville on his old 6pm newstalk show on KTOK one evening - what was funny about it was that as he was reading the letter, and I was listening to his show, I was thinking "wow, someone else feels the same way I do," and then I realized he was reading MY letter!!! 

While I got not one reply from the council to any of my letters, I will point out that Wegner "resigned" to accept a job back in Texas the next year IIRC, and many of the initial "renewal" projects in the vein of dumping the corn dogs did, at least, get put on the back burner. Unfortunately, by then, the damage had been done, and the scorched earth destruction of the fairgrounds since then has proceeded largely unabated since.

I think part of the problem is that there is no accountability on the part of the Fair Board, which oversees the fairgrounds I think as part of a trust set up with the City of OKC for some token amount of money. So there's plenty of potential for political cronyism back and forth with essentially zero opportunity for public input.

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## Urbanized

I'm nostalgic for the old fair too, but I strongly suspect you have your facts wrong about Mayor Humphreys and his involvement and the supposed statement.

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## SoonerDave

> I'm nostalgic for the old fair too, but I strongly suspect you have your facts wrong about Mayor Humphreys and his involvement and the supposed statement.


This wasn't a "supposed statement." It was an article in the Oklahoman. They were quite unabashed in their desire to reshape the fair at that time. If I can find a link, I"ll post it, but if he didn't actually say it, I'll retract the comment.

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## Urbanized

Please do. Thanks. I seriously doubt Kirk Humphreys would have ever made such a statement publicly or to the media.

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## yukong

> I can toss in a few more bits on this - the home was at least partially renovated (well, in the context of bringing it up to what was at least the idea of then-contemporary standards) by the local DAR, and they raised funds by offering tours during the fair for something like $5 a person to offset some of the expense. (My grandmother guided some of the tours one year). Obviously most of the DAR membership was median to older ladies, and the fact the home had no air conditioning meant they had to have lots of help guiding the tours because the house would get hot inside (very little breeze) and only took in a few folks at a time. They had quite a bit of volunteer labor to do some of the fixup work, and actually got the living room, kitchen, and rear area in very nice shape - more than adequate for their touring purposes. It proved too much, however. As I recall, they never had the money to fix up more than a portion of the house at a time, but due to the age of the house, as one part would be repaired, others would start to fall part. The upper floors were never opened for the tours due to the structural integrity of the first-floor ceiling, as well as the roof superstructure. I think the rate of deterioration just became too great to handle, and the DAR had to abandon it, sadly. And given the way fair management has changed over the years since that time, I rather doubt the place would have been welcome there much longer anyway. They've kicked out everything else novel and compelling  - no reason to think Goodholm would have been an exception.


I toured the Goodholm every year for the entire time it was at the fair.  They had in fact restored all of the first floor and all of the second floor.  The 3rd floor was in some level of restoration however it was only used by the people running the operation.  They went up there to change clothes and takes breaks as I recall.  But they had all the bedrooms on the second floor restored and decked out in period furniture.  It changed every year.  And at some point, they ran AC throughout as I recall seeing the floor registers that they put in place.  Your grandmother must have been the first year or so.  It was a fabulous place.

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## Laramie

I understand the need  for the transition of the 400 acre fair park complex to build more exhibit halls and large facilities for some trade show exhibits and to maintain the horse related  activities at the fairgrounds.  Let's not forget the new downtown convention center which will be available around 2020. 

Fort Worth is an aggressive competitor; they would like to lure these events to their city. 

We still need to address the iconic structures; like the monorail, space tower and the 'need' for a  grand stands or mega racing venue?

These are not new ideas:

How about a year round min-amusement operation on the fairgrounds which could involve the use of:




> 1.  A rebuilt or taller new space tower.
> 2.  Resurrect the monorail.  _Could it be tied in (seasonal) with the street car system through Stockyard City to downtown_?
> 3.  Complete renovation of the Jim Norick State Fair Arena to it make more rodeo specific.
> 4.  Feasibility study for the use of a grand stands or new mega racing venue.


We have 400 acres of prime Fair Park land which could be used _beyond the annual state fair_ for other events since we do attract visitors year round to the complex.

*"Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.*

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## shavethewhales

The old space tower isn't worth salvaging unless it can be done cheaply. It's just too old and small to be worth making a fuss over. It would be a much bigger and better deal for a prospective philanthropist to just build a new, bigger, better modern tower from Intamin. A modern super gyro tower like this one would be pretty cool: Super Gyro Tower > Towers >

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## hoya

I agree.  There's nothing really special about the existing tower.  I know a lot of people are upset about losing some of the old attractions of the state fair, but I'll be honest, none of them are very appealing today.  The old grandstands looked pretty bad to me,  I was at 89er ballpark for one of the last games, and that place was a dump.  The monorail didn't really go anywhere.  I took my nephew on the tower ride maybe 3 or 4 years ago, and while he thought it was cool (he was like 5 at the time), it really struck me how small the tower was.

The horse barns do nothing for me, but I understand we make a lot of money on it.  We may need some more permanent attractions at the fair, but I don't think the things that have actually been closed down have been that big a loss.  Putting in a 400 foot tall super gyro tower would be pretty cool.

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## Plutonic Panda

I think a taller, better tower would be better along the river. Something with a restaurant and it would be nice if it would rotate like the Reunion Tower in Dallas.

I would support spending some money to renovate the Space Tower.

Again, I've said it before and I'll say it again, the State Fair still can be brought back. We need to rebuild the mono-rail and connect it with the future convention center and I also like the idea of connecting it to the Stockyards.

Building and F1 race track on one of the large parking lots and rebuilding a master grandstand.

Add more beautification to the fair and build a large parking garage.

I would also add a glass restaurant two stories above ground right at the base of the Space Tower and keep it open year round. It would also be nice to see a year round "local" market where local merchants can gather to sell and showcase their products.

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## Laramie

Plutonic Panda, you're right on target.

Look for some new iconic structures to be included in the future of Fair Park.  There's probably enough exhibit halls and barns planned; once constructed, this should carry us into 2025. 

I really like the idea of a larger space tower.

Especially something comparable to  the 500 ft., Super Gyro Tower:

  

*"Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.*

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## Martin

from atoms to nanotubes? -M

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## Throckmorton

> We need to rebuild the mono-rail and connect it with the future convention center and I also like the idea of connecting it to the Stockyards.


Were you sent here by the devil?  :053:

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## hoya

No good sir, he's on the level.

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## Plutonic Panda

> Were you sent here by the devil?


I don't get it  :Stick Out Tongue: 

Is my monorail project not popular? :P

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## Tigerguy

> I don't get it 
> 
> Is my monorail project not popular? :P


Why wouldn't it be, Mr. Lanley? It's just as beloved here as in Brockway, Ogdenville, and North Haverbrook.

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## Urban Pioneer

I actually wanted to bid on the monorail when it went to auction but didn't have the spare cash to justify it. At the sale, I think most of it went for about $3,500.00. That midcentury stuff would be worth a lot even 5 years later. They also auctioned off all of the old New York World's Fair luminaries that were brought here after that fair was dismantled. I should have grabbed one of those but my appreciation didn't extend as far as the monorail.

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## Mel

Cover it in LEDs and have the color ability to cover any holiday or special event.

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## Laramie

> I don't get it 
> 
> Is my monorail project not popular? :P


Plutonic Panda, your vision is futuristic.  You're more  focused on ten to 15 years ahead (future), many posters here like to take it one vision step at a time (five year increments). They've seen the past mistakes made by the city, now they want progress to be more secure.

When they first opened the monorail at the fairgrounds; there were those who envisioned it running to Stockyard City traveling via Exchange Avenue to the Farmers' Market into downtown.   So, this monorail concept isn't new. 




Mayors (George H. Shirk & James Norick) had vision of building the Myriad in the late 60s with the success of the State Fair Arena; however we took the Urban Renewal route which was a decades long process along with the I.E. Pei Plan.  It took several years before a bond issue was passed to build the Myriad Convention Center and the Tivoli Gardens (now the MBG).   Our city fell behind because much of the land acquired was under the umbrella of the Urban Renewal Project Authority.   

Progress has been achieved.  Definitely remember the days when posters thought there wasn't any future for OKC; it was all about DALLAS!

 
Dallas, Texas__________Oklahoma City, OK

*"Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.*

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## ljbab728

> I took my nephew on the tower ride maybe 3 or 4 years ago, and while he thought it was cool (he was like 5 at the time), it really struck me how small the tower was.


You're a year or two off.  It's been closed since 2009.

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## hoya

> You're a year or two off.  It's been closed since 2009.


Wow.  I guess my nephew was even younger then.  I think I've been to the state fair maybe once since then.

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## Laramie

News 9 reported last night on the dismay of some fair goers who had concerns about Space Tower.   Let's hope the State Fair Board can begin plans to replace some of the iconic structures that once  branded the Great State Fair of Oklahoma.

Iconic structures at State Fairs in Tulsa & Dallas:

Tulsa's Golden Driller, *76 ft tall* 

 

Big Tex,* 55 ft tall* & Texas Star, *212 ft high* with Super Gyro Tower *500 ft*  tower in background.
What's next?
*70 ft* high arch



*"Oklahoma City looks oh-so pretty... ...as I get my kicks on Route 66." --Nat King Cole.*

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## bombermwc

I've never quite understood the arch thing and why its there.

If the thing downtown takes off (which I bet it wont), then it would be a bit redundant to have one at the fair too. I think the comment about it being free hit it on the head as to why they wont fix it. They're probably just waiting for money to tear it out. I just hope they come up with a GOOD use of the central location other than more parking or another freaking barn.

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## Urbanized

Since when was it free? The times I've ridden it you had to pay to ride it. By the way, the State Fair of Texas recently ADDED a very similar ride/tower. I rode it last year after the OU/TX game.

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## turnpup

Yeah, I seem to remember having to pay extra to ride it, too.

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## Bullbear

There was a time you paid a price to ride it. the last few years it was free and subsidized by the daily oklahoman one year and another company another year I believe. but before I think it was like a 5.00 ticket.

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## bombermwc

I don't think ive ever pad to ride it in my life. But I should note that it's been probably almost 15 years since I rode it the last time.

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## Bunty

A TV news report said the bottom of the Space Tower was ruined when flood water got into it.  It should be replaced like the one at the Texas State Fair.  Also a big new Ferris wheel should go in at the fairgrounds, big enough to knock the recently outdated Texas claim in having the nation's biggest Ferris wheel further down the list.  The nation's biggest Ferris wheel is now in Las Vegas.  A rich person should come forth and pay to build all that.  But since I'm not rich, I don't know how the rich dream of spending their millions. before they die.  But probably mostly on projects that will make more millions.

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## bombermwc

One problem with all these big rides like a needle or a ferris wheel is what do you do with it the other 350 days of the year? Buildings run shows and still bring in money to pay for them and the staff/maintenance. But these things don't make any money the rest of the year and just rot.

That's why I feel like if they do add a needle back, they need to make it a 365 day a year type project of restaurant/observation/etc like the REAL towers are. Otherwise, I'd really just rather see the thing taken out instead of sit and rust until it falls over. The monorail was another example of that type of project, but with it, at least the track was concrete and didn't really require much maintenance. And the cars were so simple...same thing. They just finally ran out of life when the grandstands got dozed (cause we could have built a platform if we really wanted to keep the rail). It would have been a much better project if the rail served a purpose, like as a people mover instead of a ride. Expand the track out to parking and whatnot and use it to get people around. Trouble is the golf cart trams are cheaper and easier to get around.

The point being, that the fair folks are going to look at what's sustainable. We had so many decades of mismanagement that allowed the place to fall to pieces that a lot of things have had to be sacrificed in order to keep the money makers open. And at the end of the day, we don't want the fair to be in the hole every year with the city/county being asked to bail them out.....or have it close. Unfortunately, that means things like a need replacement become a dollars discussion.

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## Bunty

> One problem with all these big rides like a needle or a ferris wheel is what do you do with it the other 350 days of the year? Buildings run shows and still bring in money to pay for them and the staff/maintenance. But these things don't make any money the rest of the year and just rot.


Then try asking the Texas State Fair what they do with their tower ride and Ferris wheel the rest of the year.

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## ljbab728

> Then try asking the Texas State Fair what they do with their tower ride and Ferris wheel the rest of the year.


They have a virtual permanent amusement park there.  I'm not sure that's the direction we want to go.

Summertime theme park opens Saturday at Fair Park | Dallas Morning News

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## bombermwc

Pretty sure we don't....just ask Bells in Tulsa how that worked out for them. It would also serve no purpose other than to pull business away from Frontier City, causing it to be even less "fun" than it is today, which isn't saying much. 

Look around and see how many rides are permanent. I think, and correct me if im wrong, that the carpet slide is the only one that is permanent now. And it didn't exactly cost much to build. 

The whole landscape of the place is going to change with the expo center too. Won't be sad to see the other buildings go, especially the transportation building...holy crap it's in bad shape.

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## turnpup

It seems like the current climate at the fairgrounds is one of not wanting people in there unless it's for a specific thing.  They have all but one or two entrances permanently closed to vehicles.  I believe this was done in response to some vandalism/burglary being done to the animal trailers (and possibly RVs) while they were parked there for events.  

Before that occurred, I thought it was fun to cut through there from time to time (when there weren't any big events going on) on my way home, to let my little girl look at things, to occasionally stop the car and get out to wander about, etc.  It was also a great "shortcut" between Reno and the area where our house is.  Not so any more.  They don't want you to have the freedom to drive around the campus.  They want to funnel you through that one entrance, then direct you to a particular lot to park.  It's gone from a neat place to explore to this tightly-controlled and sterile environment.

Having said that, in my opinion, If they were going to repair/replace the space needle and keep it open year-round, they'd have to do a pretty serious about-face to to make the area more welcoming to people who might come in on a whim.  I'm not sure whether they're interested in doing that, in light of the increased security measures taken in recent years.  It's probably just a sign of the times.

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